Shipping container logistics

Discussion in 'The Tiki Bar' started by JimG, Nov 17, 2016.

  1. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Which CSR member has experience in container logistics? Is it Henry?

    The company I work for is trying to get a container shipped to Guam. We are told that we need a marine survey before it can go. Is this the same surveyor that would do a boat?
     
  2. BurgundyS24

    BurgundyS24 Member

    426
    Oct 5, 2014
    Napa, CA
    Sea Ray S24. full delta enclosure. Towed by 2007 Chevy 3500 duramax/allison combo.
    350 with closed fresh water cooling
    As in the company already has the container? When I was in the moving industry we recommended matson but that was mainly to and from Hawaii. Could be a start however. Don't use Hanjin.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  3. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Yes, we already have the container... we built a motor control center in it for a job in Guam.
     
  4. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    Yes, it is Henry Boyd.
     
  5. Henry Boyd

    Henry Boyd Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Apr 24, 2007
    Newburyport, on the peaceful and serene Merrimack
    02' 280 DA
    496 w BIII
    Yes and no, mostly no. It's sort of like asking if any boat engine technician can work on Cat diesels. A tech who only has OB experience would probably not be qualified to evaluate diesels.

    Within container shipping there are basically two main disciplines, cargo surveyors and equipment condition surveyors.

    The former group is knowledgeable about specific cargo stowing techniques. The can also be called upon to verify the condition and quality of what was stowed. In other words they would confirm that eight pallets containing X number cartons of new electronic components were loaded in accordance with the Bill Of Lading. They would also provide an opinion that those pallets were properly secured within the container in accordance with RR and ocean carrier requirements.

    The latter group evaluates the condition of the container and whether it is structurally sound enough for the cargo, or that there are no defects that might cause cargo loss. They will also evaluate any previous repairs. So if somebody patched holes using duct tape, an equipment guy would flag that and reject the box. They also review the container with respect to the cargo requirements, e.g. If refrigerated, will machinery work and maintain set point though the voyage, or if the cargo is a food product does the container meet food shipment standards, likewise odor or excessive humidity within the container might be grounds for rejection.

    To get a better idea of the talent you need, you have to know who is asking for the survey and their intent, I.e. Is it the buyer who wants confirmation that the cargo loaded matches what he is buying, or is it the insurance company providing the freight coverage wanting to ensure the shipment isn't going to arrive DOA.

    Another big factor are the terms contained in the BOL. On ocean shipments the BOL defines when ownership is transferred and who is liable for the shipment.

    If this is something that is a one shot deal, or the first of many, I old strongly urge your company to hire a 3PL that has intermodal experience. International intermodal shipments are an entirely different game with different ground rules than domestic only intermodal. If you have hired a 3PL and they can't organize the proper survey, drop them immediately.

    Another reason for using a 3pl is if the cargo is going to a government, charity funded by US Aid, or military consignee. There you run into cargo preference rules. Keep in mind any carrier will contract your load, even if they don't meet the preferred carrier requirements. They see your adherence to a government PO as your business. Your Contracting Officer will not be so flexible. If you get caught in a protest by a preferential cargo carrier, you can kiss your delivery schedule goodby, and may even be socked with penalties, or have to pay the preferential carrier the difference between your carrier's rate and their published tariff. A knowledgable 3PL won't place you shipment with a non-conforming carrier.

    Using outsiders may get your existing logistics staff ticked off. But I'll tell you this past year alone I have worked on half a dozen lawsuits involving everything from fatalities, grievous bodily injury, multimillion dollar cargo loss, or property damage, and vessel, or crane damage. Each and every one has stemmed from shippers who loaded the cargo in the container using trucking industry procedures and practices. The economics are pretty simple, if you do not load a container properly and the cargo shifts during vessel loading and the box jams in the cell guides, you can expect a bill from the vessel operator at somewhere north of $ 200,000 for excessive dockage and demurrage fees. That is also assuming the ship isn't damaged. Or even worse the cargo shifts and causes a crane failure leading to the fatality of the operator. On both a moral and economic front I doubt you want to be on the receiving end of a wrongful death suit.

    Just some thoughts, if you need more help, send me a pm with an email address.

    Henry


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
     
  6. Henry Boyd

    Henry Boyd Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Apr 24, 2007
    Newburyport, on the peaceful and serene Merrimack
    02' 280 DA
    496 w BIII
    Jim,

    Sorry to have gone so far afield on the previous. The question is so basic that it suggested to me a level of inexperience that is much deeper that what type of surveyor to hire.

    Like I said, I'll be glad to help in anyway I can. I'm cutting back my consulting work these days, so I have plenty of time to take on a little job just for fun, regardless of whether it generates any revenue.

    Henry


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
     
  7. Billfletcher

    Billfletcher New Member

    913
    Feb 20, 2011
    San Diego, CA
    2014, 44, EC.
    2 X 370HP Volvo D6, DPH Duo Prop's
    And if you can accompany the container on its journey, Guam is worth seeing.
     
  8. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Thanks for the info Henry... obviously this is our first container experience. We did do enough research to know that it should be loaded with equal weight distribution and that all contents be secured from movement. The container itself is in great shape... it looks new. We certainly were not aware of the liability that could be incurred due to loading issues. Is there any insurance that we should consider to protect ourselves?
     
  9. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Yea, it will probably be me making the trip early next year to commission the system once its installed.
     
  10. Henry Boyd

    Henry Boyd Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Apr 24, 2007
    Newburyport, on the peaceful and serene Merrimack
    02' 280 DA
    496 w BIII
    Jim,

    I'll send you securing guidelines published by the AAR for the rail portion, and material on container stowing. It's the knowledge of "properly securing" that's the issue. For example FMCSA standards for highway securing are based on 0.5 g transverse acceleration/ decelerations. Transverse loads in marine mode run in the 2.0 g range with fore/aft and vertical being equally greater than highway.

    Henry


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
     
  11. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Just want to give a shout out to Henry... What a gentleman and a wealth of knowledge in the marine shipping industry! It was a pleasure speaking to you on the phone today. Thanks for taking the time out of your day to help!

    Thanks Henry!!
     
  12. HUMPH

    HUMPH Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2009
    SF BAY AREA
    2003 410DA,
    2004 C14 Caribe
    CAT 3126TA's 350HP/
    50HP Honda
    What size MCC is this and what is it controlling? Must be quite a unit to require such attention.Most (most) MCCs I have purchased were pretty simple to order from standard configurations.
     
  13. spencermoseley

    spencermoseley New Member

    1
    Dec 29, 2016
    Toronto, ON
    Boatless
    Boatless
    Hanjin is not good?
     
  14. Henry Boyd

    Henry Boyd Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Apr 24, 2007
    Newburyport, on the peaceful and serene Merrimack
    02' 280 DA
    496 w BIII
    They are in the process of going bankrupt! Although I don't know if that is the correct term as South Korean companies tend to reorganize and/or merge. Hyundai is a case in point that became spun off into several different entities, cars, steel manufacturing and shipbuilding and other subsidiaries all became separate businesses.

    Henry
     
  15. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    Sorry I missed this till now...

    We built this MCC for a rock quarry in Guam. We will be controlling about 16 devices with 8 spare buckets, including a range from 5HP feeders to 200HP hammer mills... soft starts, VFD's, and standard contactors. The heart of the control system is an A-B PLC with a Red Lion 20" touch panel.
     
  16. Steve195

    Steve195 Member SILVER Sponsor

    314
    Jan 15, 2016
    Richmond, VA
    2017 Sweetwater 2286 WB Tri-toon
    Yamaha 150 Outboard
    It's posts like this that keep this forum so interesting. NO, I didn't learn a thing about Sea Rays or boating at all, but the shipping knowledge will rest somewhere in my brain and will trigger ideas I probably would never have even thought of if I ever need to ship a container.! Good stuff!
     
  17. HeyBigb

    HeyBigb New Member

    48
    Jun 10, 2016
    Catawba Island
    2004 320 Sundancer Green Hull with Black Canvas, Radar, twin 350 Mags
    2011 260 Sundancer single 350
    twin 350 Mag Inboards
    Hello all Happy New Year . Kind of reading your shipping containers and Guam. Funny I was stationed in Guam for 2 years at The Submarine Base, Polaris Point a Marine Detachment aboard a Sub Tender and I am in Logistics as well . I am an agent for Landstar anything you may need appreceiate a shout maybe we can help you?
    Bruce
     
  18. JimG

    JimG Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2008
    Southern WV
    2007 310 DA
    Kohler 5ECD
    Twin 350 Mags
    Raw Water Cooled
    V-Drives
    An update... The crate made it to Guam! The customer said it looked great inside and was impressed with how we packed it. I'm scheduled to make the trip March 13th for commissioning.
     

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