Redistribution of someone else's wealth

So, how many here believe the $250,000 number will eventually drop to $75,000 if NObama gets elected?
 
TT that's a good one.

"From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need." Karl Marx
and Barack Husseiin Obama's idea of redistribution of someone else's wealth.


“The great task before our founders was putting into practice the ideal that government could simultaneously serve liberty and advance the common good. and Government, he believed, had an important role to play in advancing our common prosperity.”
“I chose my friends carefully. The more politically active black students. The foreign students. The Chicanos. The Marxist professors and structural feminists and punk-rock performance poets.”
“Yes, our greatness as a nation has depended on individual initiative, on a belief in the free market. But it has also depended on our sense of mutual regard for each other, of mutual responsibility. The idea that everybody has a stake in the country, that we’re all in it together and everybody’s got a shot at opportunity. Americans know this. We know that government can’t solve all our problems - and we don’t want it to. But we also know that there are some things we can’t do on our own. We know that there are some things we do better together.” Barack Hussein Obama

I think those quotes say it all...:smt009
 
I am probably wrong about this but remain one of the few who believes Obama is so out of touch with the values of this country that he will not be elected. His resume is so thin that he should go down to defeat even if his values were in synch with those that have made the country great. Guess we will all know soon enough.
 
Choosing to simply not vote is not the answer. I am not sure if Gary's math book covered that chapter, but the election statisticians for Obama's side want a large group to take just such a stance. Instead of having to worry about being elected by over 50% of the voters they now only need worry over 33.33% of the electorate to win.
 
Whimsea said:
Bill, I can't believe what I'm reading. It really does matter which candidate gets into office. I think you are a small business owner (correct me if I'm wrong please) and surely you must see the merits of one candidate getting into office over the other.

It's quite clear if Obama get's into office, small business owners will suffer greatly. I read on this site that one small business owner said he would either sell or close up his business if Obama is elected.

VOTING is one way the AMERICAN people can straighten this mess out. Please vote.

Sorry for the rant....now I feel better. :grin:
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I dont believe either candidate is in touch with the average business owner in any sense. I also do not believe there will be no liability to those of us making low to mid six figures regardless because 1. They arent ever going to cut their own gooberment spending, which leads to 2. the American people will somehow have to pay for the frivolities of the last few years. Obama is open and up front about it, McCain and company will find a way to do it covertly. Either way, we are going to get taxed.
 
Pseudomind said:
Choosing to simply not vote is not the answer. I am not sure if Gary's math book covered that chapter, but the election statisticians for Obama's side want a large group to take just such a stance. Instead of having to worry about being elected by over 50% of the voters they now only need worry over 33.33% of the electorate to win.
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Why? If I cant truly support either, I am not going to vote for either. THis will only be the second time not voting in all my life.

And you are looking at it through the decision you have made. How do you know the McCain side isnt hoping for the same exact thing?

I toe no line. Although my vote goes to the republican party most of the time, the candidates they put up this year are nincompoops. The dems did no better.
 
billandamy said:
Why? If I cant truly support either, I am not going to vote for either. THis will only be the second time not voting in all my life.

And you are looking at it through the decision you have made. How do you know the McCain side isnt hoping for the same exact thing?

I toe no line. Although my vote goes to the republican party most of the time, the candidates they put up this year are nincompoops. The dems did no better.
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I did not create the math behind the concept, and I do not care for either candidate, but in this case the perceived lessor of two evils.

In my opinion therein lies part of the problem, those who opt not to vote and those who vote not knowing who, or what they are voting for, you can bet the ones who think they will be getting something for nothing are going to vote.

Note: I prefaced this with, "In my opinion."
 
Four Suns said:
That math book only covers simple things... like everyone paying the same 5% sales tax does not mean everyone is paying the same tax...

If a rich person goes and buys and $4,000,000 boat, he/she pays $200,000 in tax. If a poor person buys a $1,000 boat, he/she is paying $50 in tax. i.e. rich person is paying 4000 times the tax as middle class person.
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Yes, I understand this point perfectly well.

And the point of "progressive taxation" is that if someone can afford to spend $4M on a boat, then they can afford to pay $300K in tax on that boat. The little guy can still only afford to pay $50, and would have a harder time paying $75 than the big guy can paying $300K.

No. . it is not "fair", in the conservative Republican sense. But it is the underlying assumption of our current tax code.

Four Suns said:
Now... where this goes astray is "poor person" says "rich person" who bought $4,000,000 boat can afford more so "poor person" gets to pay no tax and gets a $1000 tax credit to buy boat for free.
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And you are correct. This is where it does go astray. Badly. While I favor progressive taxes; I really, really loathe tax credits and government hand outs. And I believe EVERYONE should contribute. . even if it is only the $50.

Personally, I could do without tax credits of ALL kinds. Be it for children, green cars, buisness credits. Whatever.

I was highly steamed at the "economic stimulous" package put out last year.

I probably would also be steamed at the current bank bailout. . but frankly I don't understand how that is going to really work. I don't think anybody truely understands. Certainly, the buying of banks was not explicite in the what was passed by Congress.
 
mrsrobinson said:
So, how many here believe the $250,000 number will eventually drop to $75,000 if NObama gets elected?
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Of this, I truely have no doubt. Probably will see the change in numbers by March 2009.

billandamy said:
I dont believe either candidate is in touch with the average business owner in any sense. I also do not believe there will be no liability to those of us making low to mid six figures regardless because

1. They arent ever going to cut their own gooberment spending, which leads to

2. the American people will somehow have to pay for the frivolities of the last few years.

Obama is open and up front about it, McCain and company will find a way to do it covertly. Either way, we are going to get taxed. (edited to put in paragraphs)
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BINGO. BINGO. BINGO.

This is exactly where I am. Obama is saying he is going to spend-spend-spend is also saying that we will pay for his proposals.

I hear no such words from McCain (although the words appear on his website, he never talks about it seriously on the trail)

Now, however, it comes to "Who are you gonna believe?". In this very post, I state that I believe that Obama is going to raise taxes. . because that's what Democrats do. But the track record of the current Republicans in power is that they spend-spend-spend with no thought whatsoever regarding paying for any of it. That is what Republicans do.

On balance, I believe that the Obama is more likely understand Gary's math book better than McCain. Simple as that.

And with the Mountain of Debt that we have racked up over the last few years, I don't believe Obama will be able to enact any more than tidbits of his super liberal agenda.
 
Four Suns said:
That's right! 4000 times the tax is not good enough... let's make it 6000 times... How about 20,000 times? shoot... just take it all... if he can afford a $4M boat, he can afford $4M in taxes... When does it stop?
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Now THAT is the $4M question, isn't it?

I would settle for government that knows how to add.

- - - - -

As for the Corperate taxes it seems to me that both positions you portray strike me as charactures. My understanding is that market forces tend to dictate consumer prices and "costs" represent a "floor".

In past discussions, the core of your argument goes to depreciation rules which I don't know enough about to argue fully. All I know is that my parents used to run a small buisness, and it seemed that they took measures to ensure that they never turned a "profit". Profit can easily turn into "salary expenses", can't it? And yes. . they did have "capital" and "depreciation" to contend with. But I will say no more. .

Four Suns said:
. . .. seems to me that corporate taxes are just passed on to the customers and is another way of hiding taxing everyone that uses the products....
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In that many products are priced close to the "floor", I agree with that statement.
 
comsnark said:
While I favor progressive taxes; I really, really loathe tax credits and government hand outs. And I believe EVERYONE should contribute. . even if it is only the $50.

Personally, I could do without tax credits of ALL kinds. Be it for children, green cars, buisness credits. Whatever.
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And this point supports Bill's point about voting the man versus voting the party. It was Richard Nixon (R) whose administration introduced us to the Earned Income Tax Credit as well as reintroducing (for a while, until they proved that thet weren't working) wage and price controls as a means to fight inflation.

We need to elect people to public office who are both smart, have common sense, and have the welfare of all the country in mind and not just enough interest groups to get just enough votes in just enough jurisdictions to win.
 
billandamy said:
You surround yourself with those of like mind? Most of the people I know as well are for McCain as well, but there are also a good amount of Obama supporters. In my polls it is probably 60/40.

I am not voting. I think they both suck donkey balls. I dont think it matters one iota who gets into office this election. The time has come once again for the American PEOPLE to straighten this mess out, and not look to the gooberment to solve problems.
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Not voting is not the answer. Think of all those service men and women who died to give you the right to vote! I don't like the choices either, but that is a cop out in my book!!!
 
At Ease said:
Not voting is not the answer. Think of all those service men and women who died to give you the right to vote! I don't like the choices either, but that is a cop out in my book!!!
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thats okay. I went across the river into ohio and voted 5 times to make up for people who don't vote!:grin: Got some free cigarette's to boot!
 
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