Re-bedding Swim Ladder - Questions

[obsessive]

Well, between the fact that it's the wettest year in recent history here, and the seemingly odd amount of moisture issues I've been running into both at home and on the boat, I have one more to add to the mix.

I have to re-bed the swim ladder, a simple procedure in itself. BUT, since we've only had a couple of days in between 3" rain storms at the most, how the heck do I dry out the holes in the swim platform before re-sealing? I know that water has made it past the bolts and has sat in the area between bolts and the fiberglass until I discovered that they were leaking. While the area is still nice and hard (not squishy), I surely don't want to seal the moisture in with no way for it to get out as I'm sure rot could set in, not to mention that we have freezing weather.

So- Given the fact that the area is solid---
1. Do I wait until fall and hope for dryer weather, remove the ladder and leave the holes to air out?
2. Do I remove the ladder now on a nice day, pour acetone into the holes to try to displace the moisture, then re-seal?
3. <--- Insert suggestion here...

 

[obsessive]

Any ideas?

I also have an idea of removing the ladder, flushing the holes with acetone, re-bedding the ladder, then drilling small weep holes from the underside (in the bilge area - remember, this lader is part of the bilge) to allow for drying. Over the fall, it should dry out nicely, then I can re-seal them before spring launching.

 

[Lazy Daze]

Well, another route is a heat lamp, hair dryer, heat gun. Obviously, you don't want it blasted right on the gel, but adjust how far away it is so it's just warm. But, if it was me, I think I'd wait and let it dry out nice and good naturally. I see nothing wrong with drilling some drainage holes, but don't the bolts already go all the way through (through bolted)? It's been a while since I've been that far into a model similar to yours, so I'm not positive.

 

[obsessive]

Well, another route is a heat lamp, hair dryer, heat gun. Obviously, you don't want it blasted right on the gel, but adjust how far away it is so it's just warm. But, if it was me, I think I'd wait and let it dry out nice and good naturally. I see nothing wrong with drilling some drainage holes, but don't the bolts already go all the way through (through bolted)? It's been a while since I've been that far into a model similar to yours, so I'm not positive.

I appreciate your input, you've been a great resource for me.

The holes do go all the way through, but I was thinking of re-bedding it, and if I did that it would prevent more moisture from getting in, but would require another way to get it out (that's why I was going to drill some drainage holes on the underside in the bilge).

I'm pretty sure that water was in there last year when freezing hit and possibly delaminated a small area around a couple of the holes. It's hard to tell, as I can see water 'squish' out from around the ladder bracket if I place my barefoot directly next to the mount, but then agian, the mounts a little loose too. The area is completely solid feeling and sounding (barefoot test and a screwdriver handle strike).

I checked with a long-time boating friend, and he said that the best way would be to wait until fall (as wood damage happens over YEARS not months), take the ladder out completely, and leave it out for fall/winter. Since they shrink wrap the boat past this area, it should dry out nicely all by itself. Then re-bed it in spring. He thought this would be the best way instead of trying to rush the drying.

 

[Lazy Daze]

Yeah, don't want to rush it. If you shrink it - put plenty of vents in. The downside of shrink (compared to a full, breathable cover) is it can actually hold moisture in. Once you get it dry, I think you'll be fine without drilling any more drainage holes. Just be sure to smear some silicone inside the holes, trying to cover up/"paint" the entire inside of the hole.

Not to beat this to death, but I would suggest looking into having a full cover made for your boat. You'll recoup the cost of the cover over just a few years since you don't have to keep paying for shrink. Carver Covers makes a very nice, custom cover at a reasonable price. I sell quite a few of those. Even use them for our new Sea Rays.

 

[obsessive]

I'll look into the cover. For some reason, I haven't even thought of a storage cover that would work well over the winter. Shrinking is pricey.

 

[tobnpr]

I wouldn't let it wait until winter, unless you keep it in heated storage- or you're POSITIVE that the moisture has not spread further into the core and is just on the surface around the bolts holes. I'd get it dried out in the fall- a halogen lamp close (not too close) to the surface will help.

There was a post here a while back from a guy with a platform that was completely split apart on the bottom side and was wondering what caused it. Two things- wet core, and freezing temperatures.
If the core is wet, and it freezes, you'll have far bigger issues than the bolt holes.

 

[obsessive]

I wouldn't let it wait until winter, unless you keep it in heated storage- or you're POSITIVE that the moisture has not spread further into the core and is just on the surface around the bolts holes. I'd get it dried out in the fall- a halogen lamp close (not too close) to the surface will help.

There was a post here a while back from a guy with a platform that was completely split apart on the bottom side and was wondering what caused it. Two things- wet core, and freezing temperatures.
If the core is wet, and it freezes, you'll have far bigger issues than the bolt holes.

I definately won't wait until winter to get to it. I plan on having the boat pulled well before freezing temps (in the early/mid Fall) set in as im not at all positive that it didn't make it between the glass and the core (BTW - I did see that post where the guy had the split platform). I figure that if I'm able to get it pulled out for the season, sufficiently cover the area so that it doesn't get rained on, and remove the ladder so that it can dry, it'll have quite some time to air out. It's supposed to be decent here for the next several days, so I'll go down to the marina and remove the bolts/ladder and see what I've got to look forward to tomorrow.

 

[tobnpr]

You might consider drilling a few exploratory holes on the underside of the platform (little ones, 1/8" is fine) in the vicinity of the platform bolts (bottom side, natch). If the wood shavings on the drill bit come out dry, you're good to go... patch them up with a little Marine-Tex or epoxy of your choice. If the water instrusion is more extensive, you can drill a bunch of larger holes (1/4" or so) into the core to facilitate the drying process.

I added dinghy davits a few years ago after buying the boat, and the bases mount to the platform. I overdrilled the holes slightly (just a 1/16 "), then took a pipe cleaner, dipped into some West System 5 minute epoxy, and brushed the inside of the hole with it, coating the balsa core. I do this all the time, if the sealant fails the water still can't get to the balsa core...

Hope it's an easy fix. If you find it's wet in a larger area than you thought, be patient and allow the core to dry thoroughly before closing it up.

 

[obsessive]

You might consider drilling a few exploratory holes on the underside of the platform (little ones, 1/8" is fine) in the vicinity of the platform bolts (bottom side, natch). If the wood shavings on the drill bit come out dry, you're good to go... patch them up with a little Marine-Tex or epoxy of your choice. If the water instrusion is more extensive, you can drill a bunch of larger holes (1/4" or so) into the core to facilitate the drying process.

I added dinghy davits a few years ago after buying the boat, and the bases mount to the platform. I overdrilled the holes slightly (just a 1/16 "), then took a pipe cleaner, dipped into some West System 5 minute epoxy, and brushed the inside of the hole with it, coating the balsa core. I do this all the time, if the sealant fails the water still can't get to the balsa core...

Hope it's an easy fix. If you find it's wet in a larger area than you thought, be patient and allow the core to dry thoroughly before closing it up.

Well, since there's was supposed to be good weather here for the next several days we pulled the ladder (WE - yes, two, as by myself I couldn't keep the bolt jeads from spinning up top when I was in the engine compartment). I found that SR only 'sealed' three of the holes, and there was only a dollop of sealant near them. It was doing NO good what-so-ever. I swear, there are so many corners cut on these (read-all) boats it's depressing.

The wood was wet directly around the holes, but only damaged 1/16-1/8" in, with the exception of one hole, which was rotted 1/4" towards the front side. It appears to be marine plywood in this area, not balsa. I used one of my scribes to check damage depth. Fortunately, no water came pouring out when we pulled the bolts, and it is nice and solid. We left the ladder off, and it's been sitting in the sun with the smaller engine hatch out and the cockpit cover partway off to allow ventilation through the engine compartment. I'm sure the moisture itself penetrated a bit further, but it hasn't rotted the wood. It's amazing with the (lack of) sealing that SR did out of the factory that the whole thing isn't rotted.

I may leave the ladder off for awhile, and seal the top of the holes with silione (leaving the bottom open into the bilge) to allow for further drying. I can easily clean it off later.

I read on a surveyors website that whenever they needed to place anything through the hull/deck/etc., that they drilled the hole larger than needed, filled the hole with epoxy, re-drilled it to the intended size (on center), then mounted whatever it was that they wanted. Sounds like a good idea, possibly one that i'll follow when I reinstall these. I assume that's pretty much what you're suggesting.

 

[Lazy Daze]

Do you have any shrink-wrap tape (or something similar)? Not duct tape - it will soften in the sun too much. Since you're going to leave the ladder off, you could put the tape over the holes on days when the they might get wet. Pull the tape off on the good days.

I'd hold off on drilling any bigger holes - it may just turn out perfectly fine the way it is. Be patient and let Mother Nature try her hand at it, first.

However, a few 1/8" exploratory holes around the big holes won't hurt anything (checking for wet wood on the drill bit as mentioned above). Either way, give it a few weeks until you do any extra drilling.

 

[obsessive]

Do you have any shrink-wrap tape (or something similar)? Not duct tape - it will soften in the sun too much. Since you're going to leave the ladder off, you could put the tape over the holes on days when the they might get wet. Pull the tape off on the good days.

I'd hold off on drilling any bigger holes - it may just turn out perfectly fine the way it is. Be patient and let Mother Nature try her hand at it, first.

However, a few 1/8" exploratory holes around the big holes won't hurt anything (checking for wet wood on the drill bit as mentioned above). Either way, give it a few weeks until you do any extra drilling.

Hmmm... I don't have any shrink wrap tape, but I can pick some up. Yeah, duct tape would be a nightmare on that, it almost turns to goo when it gets warm. I've not settled on a dollop of silicone over the tops of the holes as the ultimate (temporaty) solution, although, it should be easy to remove once I'm ready..

I'll leave the main holes as is. Is the purpose of the exploratory holes just to tell when everythings dried out or something else?

 

[Lazy Daze]

Is the purpose of the exploratory holes just to tell when everythings dried out or something else?

Well, if you did them now, it would give you an idea of how far (if at all) the water intruded. If you did them later, then it would do just as you're thinking.

Even without the little exploratory holes, it will dry out. A case could be made for both drilling holes now or just waiting it out.


If don't drill now, it might take a bit longer to dry. But, you'll only need to drill a few holes in the fall to check that everything is dry.

If you drilled them now, you'd get an idea of how far the water intruded and it may dry faster. But, you'd still have to drill a few more holes in the fall to check that everything is indeed dry.

If it was me, I would wait to drill - unless I poked around and found some obvious spots that seem to be water logged - but either way will work.

 

[obsessive]

Well, if you did them now, it would give you an idea of how far (if at all) the water intruded. If you did them later, then it would do just as you're thinking.

Even without the little exploratory holes, it will dry out. A case could be made for both drilling holes now or just waiting it out.


If don't drill now, it might take a bit longer to dry. But, you'll only need to drill a few holes in the fall to check that everything is dry.

If you drilled them now, you'd get an idea of how far the water intruded and it may dry faster. But, you'd still have to drill a few more holes in the fall to check that everything is indeed dry.

If it was me, I would wait to drill - unless I poked around and found some obvious spots that seem to be water logged - but either way will work.

I'll wait to drill them, because as long as it dries out and is not rotted beyond the very small are around the one hole, then I assume it'll be just fine. I also base this on the fact that it is solid and sounds fine when tapped with a screwdriver handle. I'll just drill them this fall to check.

 

[tobnpr]

Making, then drilling back through, a solid epoxy "plug" as you read is different than what I suggested, and is a better choice where it will work.
It's better than coating the inside of the hole with epoxy as I suggested, but if the area is exposed, overdrilling the hole by that much might actually make the plug visible outside the hardware you're installing if it's not large enought to cover the larger hole.

 

[staylor]

Re: installing new OEM replacement swim ladder

.......any helpfull suggestions for installing a new swim ladder. I bought the boat without the ladder attatched. It has 6 holes predrilled on the swim platform where the ladder was mounted. Is the swim platform fiberglass sturdy enough to hold the new ladder with standard screws (fit to width) or does the ladder require some sort of anchor bolts?

My boat is a Sea Ray 215 Express Crusier with top mounted swim ladder

Thanks for your help

 

[Lazy Daze]

Re: installing new OEM replacement swim ladder

.......any helpfull suggestions for installing a new swim ladder. I bought the boat without the ladder attatched. It has 6 holes predrilled on the swim platform where the ladder was mounted. Is the swim platform fiberglass sturdy enough to hold the new ladder with standard screws (fit to width) or does the ladder require some sort of anchor bolts?

My boat is a Sea Ray 215 Express Crusier with top mounted swim ladder

Thanks for your help

It should be through-bolted.


Obsessive: Any update? Or, did you figure on waiting until Spring?

 

[obsessive]

I decided to keep them removed (I capped them off with small plastic push-fasteners with trimmed stems) and siliconed the tops (leaving the bottom of the holes exposed to the bilge). I decided to keep them open like this trough the winter to completely dry. It dried out seemingly well during the end of the season, but I figured for good measure, it wouldn't hurt leaving them out over the winter. In the spring, I will rebed.

The boat won't see the water this year, we're trying to sell our home (upsizing due to a new little-one) and we're not sure where we're going to 'land' (could be one of three pools of the Mississippi). So, it should give me time to perform some maintenance at my schedule.

 

[obsessive]

Just an update - since the boat was layed up last year, the holes had plenty of an opportunity to dry out. Rebedded the ladder, and bolted her up. Good to go.