QSM11 repair questions

Discussion in 'Diesel Engines/Drives/Transmissions/Props' started by SeaNile, Jan 20, 2022.

  1. SeaNile

    SeaNile Well-Known Member

    Aug 16, 2010
    Chadds Ford, PA
    2003 50 Sundancer
    Cummins QSM11
    Couple of questions regarding QSM repairs completed.

    Back in 2013 a lot of repairs and maintenance was done on the engines and genset before the current owner purchased the boat and brought it from FL to his home port. Broker said, which makes complete sense to me, that the owner wanted absolutely anything and everything gone over and repaired before he brought the boat up the coast.

    Engines- exhaust manifolds port and starboard were noted to be leaking so everything was disassembled, cleaned, replaced, etc. New manifolds, new gaskets, new bolts, thermostats, expansion tanks, etc. (20k repair). Oil noted to be leaking from oil pan- both engines had new front cover and gaskets installed (28k repair). New raw water hoses installed, valves adjusted and a few other minor things like zincs replaced.

    Generator-remove and install new isolators, replace main bearing, belts, heat exchanger gaskets, valve adjustment (4200 bill)

    So with these items being addressed in 2013 and also the usual oil changes, impeller changes current will those major items listed above need to be done again or have all the QSM issues been resolved and I'm good to go? I haven't confirmed the props, GPH or WOT info which is vital to these engines. Looks to me like the heat exchangers and after coolers need to be cleaned again but other than that the boat seems very well cared for with documentation of all the work done.

    It's a weird feeling. In the back of my mind I know all these repairs are a good thing but when I add up the bills and see over 50k in receipts my initial instinct is to run!

    Thoughts?
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2022
    mrsrobinson likes this.
  2. quality time

    quality time Well-Known Member

    Oct 30, 2007
    Upper Chesapeake Bay
    2003 480DB
    QSM11's
    My initial thought is that somebody took the owner for a ride. $28k to replace the front cover gaskets? I know the front of the engine needs lifted to do this job but that sounds ridiculous.

    If the manifolds are not currently leaking and the boat's been propped to keep load and fuel burn down I say you're good. Other than cleaning the coolers and exchangers as you mentioned but honestly that is the best time to repair the manifolds if needed since you're already in that far.
     
  3. Jeremygavin

    Jeremygavin Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Mar 6, 2012
    Cape Cod, MA
    2011 520 Sedan Bridge
    2016 Sea Ray 19 SPX OB
    2019 Walker Bay Generation 340
    Cummins QSM11s
    Mercury 150 Fourstroke
    Honda 40hp
    Agreed. If they got the fuel burn corrected then you have a much better chance of being good with the manifolds. As some have said, it is a crap shoot whether or not they will leak again. I have been lucky, my boat had around 950hrs last winter when we did all the maintenance to it with VERY little soot showing. I had the manifolds trued up, bolts replaced, ect just because we had everything else off and out of the way. I had bought the boat in 2017 with about 630hrs on it and it was way over propped but had been that way for the first 630hrs with no signs of exhaust leaks at the survey. I immediately brought the pitch down so the last 300hrs were at the correct fuel burn. Most of my cruising is at 2000rpms.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2022
    SeaNile likes this.
  4. tc410

    tc410 Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 9, 2006
    Charlevoix, MI/Jupiter, FL
    2005 550DB
    MAN CRM-900
    @SeaNile, the manifold leaks are easy to spot. Look for black dust where the manifold bolts to the engine. It’s easy to spot against the white engine paint. If you don’t see any, then you should be in good shape. The other repairs that you mention don’t seem normal or routine to me, so I wouldn’t expect to encounter them again.
     
  5. SeaNile

    SeaNile Well-Known Member

    Aug 16, 2010
    Chadds Ford, PA
    2003 50 Sundancer
    Cummins QSM11
    It's a good feeling to finally have a documented history of a boat with receipts and description of work. Once the big stuff was done at the time of purchase in 2013 it looks like all routine stuff with the last oil change being in June of 2021.
     
  6. SeaNile

    SeaNile Well-Known Member

    Aug 16, 2010
    Chadds Ford, PA
    2003 50 Sundancer
    Cummins QSM11
    Went to check out the boat again yesterday and managed to take more pictures. I can't find any black dust anywhere on the engines. From talking to the broker, diesel guy that works on the boat and the owner this boat was maintained with an open check book.

    See anything to be concerned about?
     

    Attached Files:

  7. SeaNile

    SeaNile Well-Known Member

    Aug 16, 2010
    Chadds Ford, PA
    2003 50 Sundancer
    Cummins QSM11
    More pics
     

    Attached Files:

  8. tc410

    tc410 Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 9, 2006
    Charlevoix, MI/Jupiter, FL
    2005 550DB
    MAN CRM-900
    @SeaNile Check your very last three pics. Looks like you could have some coolant leaking out of the fittings. Cummins use blue coolant.
     
  9. SeaNile

    SeaNile Well-Known Member

    Aug 16, 2010
    Chadds Ford, PA
    2003 50 Sundancer
    Cummins QSM11
    And more...

    I wasn't sure that what blue stuff was given it was visible on both engines. At first I thought it could be a kind of grease, etc.

    If it is coolant, is this an easy fix? Just tighten up the bolts?
     
  10. Jeremygavin

    Jeremygavin Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Mar 6, 2012
    Cape Cod, MA
    2011 520 Sedan Bridge
    2016 Sea Ray 19 SPX OB
    2019 Walker Bay Generation 340
    Cummins QSM11s
    Mercury 150 Fourstroke
    Honda 40hp
    Non of the pics are of the area where you would look see the exhaust leaks. You need to look between the heat exchanger and head to see where the exhaust manifolds mount to the head. This is where you would see soot if you had a leak. You are looking for diesel soot around the mounting flanges on the exhaust manifolds.
     
  11. Strecker25

    Strecker25 Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Nov 20, 2014
    Rochester, NY
    2002 410DA
    Caterpillar 350HP 3126
    not a Cummins guy so this could be off base but what metal is that flange? It almost looks like oxidation
     
  12. ttmott

    ttmott PhD in OCD TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 3, 2012
    Space Coast Florida
    2006 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM11
    That piping is all raw water. It almost looks like some sort of a sealant; there should be nothing but a coat of lubricant on the O-Rings behind those flanges. I wonder what that is all about....
     
  13. TNT8808

    TNT8808 Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    827
    May 25, 2016
    West Michigan
    2008 48 Sundancer
    Cummins QSC 8.3's
    Avon Seasport 340
    40 HP Yamaha
    @ttmott...did they use some type of bronze adapter? I blew up the pic, and it looks like it's potentially oxidized with some type of grey lube or never seize as well.
    Screen Shot 2022-03-06 at 6.29.10 PM.png
     
  14. ttmott

    ttmott PhD in OCD TECHNICAL Contributor GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 3, 2012
    Space Coast Florida
    2006 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM11
    I seem to remember those AC closeout plates being bronze. Could be corrosion from a raw water weep.... But it looks odd..
     
  15. tc410

    tc410 Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Oct 9, 2006
    Charlevoix, MI/Jupiter, FL
    2005 550DB
    MAN CRM-900
    Being on the raw water side was exactly my concern. Seeing something that looks like anti-freeze on the raw water side is never a good sign. I suspected some sort of corrosion initially as others have mentioned, but zooming in, the blue stains appear to run down the engine at point of attachment. Anyway, hopefully a simple solution, but I’ve never seen something like that before.
     
    TNT8808 likes this.
  16. Maybe A Dancer

    Maybe A Dancer Became a Dancer 12/23/21 GOLD Sponsor

    409
    Aug 20, 2021
    Florida West Coast
    Started out as MAYBE A DANCER
    Became a Dancer - 12/23/21
    450 DA Sundancer running CAT 3126
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    I used this product on a raw water hose that required removal to access a zinc on my Yanmars:

    Rectorseal Blue Pipe Thread Sealant 1.75 oz - Ace Hardware

    It made the periodic removal so much easier

    could be a coincidence, but it looked EXACTLY like what appears in the photo above.

    RWS
     
  17. SeaNile

    SeaNile Well-Known Member

    Aug 16, 2010
    Chadds Ford, PA
    2003 50 Sundancer
    Cummins QSM11
    Frustrating….I got one very reputable Cummins guy saying everything is fine, don’t over think it but clean up the area, new gasket and lots of grease. Other well known (yet a little in your face) says they look like shit, leaking coolant, gasket dust is everywhere, heads are leaking and guarantees the engines won’t reach 2370.

    Scheduling survey for next week. Not even sure who to trust anymore. I could always go with “ignorance is bliss” attitude!!
     
  18. Jeremygavin

    Jeremygavin Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Mar 6, 2012
    Cape Cod, MA
    2011 520 Sedan Bridge
    2016 Sea Ray 19 SPX OB
    2019 Walker Bay Generation 340
    Cummins QSM11s
    Mercury 150 Fourstroke
    Honda 40hp
    That is concerning that you got two different opinions on the motors. Is there one guy you would trust his opinion over the other?
    The chrome piping is carrying seawater from the seawater pump to the inlet on heat exchanger and then from the heat exchanger to the after cooler. I have to assume the blue is seawater corrosion and not antifreeze because I don’t believe there’s any antifreeze at those connections.
     
  19. quality time

    quality time Well-Known Member

    Oct 30, 2007
    Upper Chesapeake Bay
    2003 480DB
    QSM11's
    I agree that looks like corrosion from seawater leaks, strange that all of the connections are leaking though. It also looks like the area where the wiring harness plugs are has been repainted bright white. This isn't a normal area to touch up so was this replaced?

    Seems the seawater leaks should have been evident to the owner especially with engine access on a Dancer.
     
  20. Maybe A Dancer

    Maybe A Dancer Became a Dancer 12/23/21 GOLD Sponsor

    409
    Aug 20, 2021
    Florida West Coast
    Started out as MAYBE A DANCER
    Became a Dancer - 12/23/21
    450 DA Sundancer running CAT 3126
    Suggest spraying some BRAKLEEN solvent on the mystery blue stuff

    If it melts off easily it may just be excess blue sealant shown above.

    If it doesn't then you can rule this possibility out.

    BEST !

    RWS
     

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