Newbie - Looking for Suggestions on First Boat

[KStruglia]

I am a newbie looking for a boat and would really welcome any thoughts, suggestions and/or opinions. Here is my situation: I have a family of 4 – wife, 11 yr old son and 1 year old son (they will be closer to 12 and 2 by the time I get a boat for next season). Live in South Eastern PA, and would plan to keep my boat at a marina somewhere on the Chesapeake Bay (no trailering) - considering SkipJack Cove (on the Sassafras River) or Bohemia Bay Yacht Harbour (opinions about these marinas?). Would like to get something that would allow us to do some extended trips or weekend overnighters. I had one boat in my time, a 20’ cuddy, but that was almost 20 years ago, so I consider myself new to boating again. I have looked a lot of boats online as well as a few at some dealers/marina’s recently. I’m looking for something fairly new (thinking 2004-2006) for reliability/maintenance reasons. When I started my search, I was thinking of something around 24’, and then I worked my way up to 26’, now my wife is pushing me to 28’ minimum, and maybe something bigger, because the Sea Ray dealer convinced her that the 280 was way more stable than a 260, and he showed her a brand spankin’ new 310 – who wouldn’t want that! I think a 280 Sundancer is a good fit for us right now as it can sleep 4, seems to be more stable than a 260, has twin engines which appear to be good for safety reasons as well as docking (although I have never had the experience of driving a boat with twins). So far, we have looked at several brands and seem to be hooked on Sea Ray. I see that most people generally feel like a bigger boat is better, but I am a bit concerned about having too big of a boat for a first boat, and I really don’t want to sit at the dock every weekend because the boat is too hard to handle or burns too much gas. Thoughts/opinions on boat size or other considerations would be appreciated.

 

[Presentation]

.....and I really don’t want to sit at the dock every weekend because the boat is too hard to handle or burns too much gas.....

Welcome to CSR.

You are asking all the correct questions.

I just want to make sure you know what you are getting into.

You mentioned the cost of gas. Coming from a smaller trailer boat may be your frame of reference.

Our boat averages 1.37 MPG and that is one of the smaller expenses of this boat’s yearly expenses.


Depreciation $7,000.00 year
Summer Slip & winter storage $3,500.00 year
Maintenance/repairs $2,500.00 year
Fuel $2,500.00 year
Insurance/other $2,000.00 year
Total $17,500.00 year


I think some of my expenses like slip/storage and insurance may even be lower in my area then your area.

 

[MaddyDean]

You did not say anything about water sports or fishing. I have a 280 Dancer and the thing I dislike the most is no fishing rigs and it is not really meant for tubing and Skiing is out of the questions.

This is my first year with twins and I could never see myself going back. Three years with my old 20' cuddy and never truly got the hang--Day one on the twins i did a better job docking then those previous three years.

In the 280, I want bigger or smaller. the 280 just does not do it for me. I would either want a smaller (If it had twins) so i can do more water sports, especially with a 11 and 7 year olds. Or I would want bigger since the 280 already has the limitations mentioned, I rather have more space.

As presentation said--it becomes a COO decision and if I had the moneys, I would go bigger.

Of course the best of both worlds would be a bigger boat for cruising and a nice small 20--bow rider for water sports and a little fishing. :thumbsup:

 

[KStruglia]

Welcome to CSR.

You are asking all the correct questions.

I just want to make sure you know what you are getting into.

You mentioned the cost of gas. Coming from a smaller trailer boat may be your frame of reference.

Our boat averages 1.37 MPG and that is one of the smaller expenses of this boat’s yearly expenses.


Depreciation $7,000.00 year
Summer Slip & winter storage $3,500.00 year
Maintenance/repairs $2,500.00 year
Fuel $2,500.00 year
Insurance/other $2,000.00 year
Total $17,500.00 year


I think some of my expenses like slip/storage and insurance may even be lower in my area then your area.

Thanks for the Welcome and Feedback. For expenses, I was expecting 3,500-4,500 for slip and storage and I did anticipate maintenance/repairs and Insurance (although I wasn't sure how much they would be). I didn't mean to make it sound like I wasn't willing to buy gas; it just seemed like a .66 miles per gallon that it could be astronomical! $2,500 for gas for the whole season seems more than reasonable to me.

 

[KStruglia]

You did not say anything about water sports or fishing. I have a 280 Dancer and the thing I dislike the most is no fishing rigs and it is not really meant for tubing and Skiing is out of the questions.

This is my first year with twins and I could never see myself going back. Three years with my old 20' cuddy and never truly got the hang--Day one on the twins i did a better job docking then those previous three years.

In the 280, I want bigger or smaller. the 280 just does not do it for me. I would either want a smaller (If it had twins) so i can do more water sports, especially with a 11 and 7 year olds. Or I would want bigger since the 280 already has the limitations mentioned, I rather have more space.

As presentation said--it becomes a COO decision and if I had the moneys, I would go bigger.

Of course the best of both worlds would be a bigger boat for cruising and a nice small 20--bow rider for water sports and a little fishing. :thumbsup:

MaddyDean,
Thanks for the thoughts. I knew I'd leave some critical info out of the post... I would want to do some light casual fishing, but probably not too much. As far as water sports, well, I'd love to be able to ski, but I already assumed that would be out of the question for a boat like this, and I'm willing to give it up for the other conveniences of an Express Cruiser. However, I was assuming that we would be able to do some light tubing. I definately see your point about two boats if money were no object, but that's out of the question right now. So putting aside the water sports, what size boat would you get if you were to do it over again?
Thanks,
Kraig

 

[Presentation]

MaddyDean,
Thanks for the thoughts. I knew I'd leave some critical info out of the post... I would want to do some light casual fishing, but probably not too much. As far as water sports, well, I'd love to be able to ski, but I already assumed that would be out of the question for a boat like this, and I'm willing to give it up for the other conveniences of an Express Cruiser. However, I was assuming that we would be able to do some light tubing. I definately see your point about two boats if money were no object, but that's out of the question right now. So putting aside the water sports, what size boat would you get if you were to do it over again?
Thanks,
Kraig

We tube, knee board and ski behind our 280 Sundancer with twin 5.0’s. I can pull my wife up on 1 ski in about 6-7 seconds. The wake is big but it works.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHRdM0OYMq8[/youtube]

We pan fish but not troll. Sterndrives are simply not intended to be used for trolling.

 

[290sundancer]

I have single 7.4 in a 270da yeah its harder to dock than twins but u get used to what u have, i havent owned a boat till this year i grew up on boats and i put the boat in the slip first try key is go slow slow let the boat tell you what to do pop it in and out of gear make little stering moves in gear. and with a family i would get at least 28 feet if your out for couple days u dont want to feel like you standing on top of each other. we had a 24 sea ray weekender it was kinda tight with 4 people. right now is great time to buy boats so u should find a nice one, and if you get slightly older one u will get bigger i almost bought a 1993 30 sundancer for 18,900. lot of boats in that range and are still nice. did u try yachtworld for a search.

 

[MaddyDean]

MaddyDean,
Thanks for the thoughts. I knew I'd leave some critical info out of the post... I would want to do some light casual fishing, but probably not too much. As far as water sports, well, I'd love to be able to ski, but I already assumed that would be out of the question for a boat like this, and I'm willing to give it up for the other conveniences of an Express Cruiser. However, I was assuming that we would be able to do some light tubing. I definately see your point about two boats if money were no object, but that's out of the question right now. So putting aside the water sports, what size boat would you get if you were to do it over again?
Thanks,
Kraig

On the 280--light tubing can be done. Skiing, like Presentation wrote is tough.

I am already looking at around 39' LOA at this time. A sedan Bridge would be preferred but not necessary.

Please however, don't go be me..this is just what the wife and I are talking about.

This year we spent a lot of time on the boat (Not as much as we would have liked--but a lot) and having guest on the boat--it got over crowded quickly. there were many times that I and a friend stood on the Swim platform (BTW--extended swim platform a must) for hours so my guest had comfort. I did not mind but an extra few feet of cockpit space would have been great. Also, the kids kept trying to control the swim platform and throw me in the water--good times.

 

[tdschafer]

KS,
Welcome to CSR! My best friend purchased a 2003 280 DA in 2006 as his first ever boat. He got the hang of the twin I/O's pretty quick and he NEVER drove a boat before in his life. So don't worry too much about the docking aspect. Now with that being said I think you really have to consider the beam on a boat. That is what will make the cabin feel roomy or cramped. My friend has a 6 year old daughter and 14 year old son. He is now looking to sell his boat and go to a little older but bigger boat like the 330 DA. I have seen boats like mine come down in price pretty significantly lately. There is a fellow member here ,Dpmulvey, who has a 330 with a Hard top for around 60K. That is an awesome option that I have not seen elsewhere. So, you have made a very good start on your research and will find a wealth of knowledge here. Good luck with the search!
Todd

 

[Gunn]

Welcome to the club!
I have had a '95 175 bowrider for 4 years now and just last week purchased an '03 280 Sundancer. Like you, we started looking for a cruiser and it kept creeping up and up in size until we reached the 280 which seems ideal for us in all the right ways for where we want to go (Chesapeake Bay also). I think you'll hear that a lot from the 280 owners here.

It's going to be delivered this Saturday and while I'm good at docking my little 175, I've very nervous and intimidated by the size of the 280 in comparison. But I can't wait...

Good luck in your search!

btw, we fish and troll all the time for bluefish and rockfish (strippers, striped bass) with our 175, nothing wrong with a sterndrive when it's all you have!

 

[KStruglia]

Welcome to the club!
I have had a '95 175 bowrider for 4 years now and just last week purchased an '03 280 Sundancer. Like you, we started looking for a cruiser and it kept creeping up and up in size until we reached the 280 which seems ideal for us in all the right ways for where we want to go (Chesapeake Bay also). I think you'll hear that a lot from the 280 owners here.

It's going to be delivered this Saturday and while I'm good at docking my little 175, I've very nervous and intimidated by the size of the 280 in comparison. But I can't wait...

Good luck in your search!

btw, we fish and troll all the time for bluefish and rockfish (strippers, striped bass) with our 175, nothing wrong with a sterndrive when it's all you have!

Gunn,

Thanks for the Welcome and feedback. This is a great site for getting info on people's personal experiences. CONGRATS on the new boat! Maybe we'll be lucky enough to do the same.
Kraig

 

[KStruglia]

KS,
Welcome to CSR! My best friend purchased a 2003 280 DA in 2006 as his first ever boat. He got the hang of the twin I/O's pretty quick and he NEVER drove a boat before in his life. So don't worry too much about the docking aspect. Now with that being said I think you really have to consider the beam on a boat. That is what will make the cabin feel roomy or cramped. My friend has a 6 year old daughter and 14 year old son. He is now looking to sell his boat and go to a little older but bigger boat like the 330 DA. I have seen boats like mine come down in price pretty significantly lately. There is a fellow member here ,Dpmulvey, who has a 330 with a Hard top for around 60K. That is an awesome option that I have not seen elsewhere. So, you have made a very good start on your research and will find a wealth of knowledge here. Good luck with the search!
Todd

Todd,

Thanks for the feedback. Nice Boat you have there! 60K is about what I'm willing to spend. The 330 is georgeous, but seems awfully big for a first timer to handler. Also, I was hoping to get a little newer and smaller as opposed to older and bigger.
Kraig

 

[KStruglia]

We tube, knee board and ski behind our 280 Sundancer with twin 5.0’s. I can pull my wife up on 1 ski in about 6-7 seconds. The wake is big but it works.

[youtube]YHRdM0OYMq8[/youtube]

We pan fish but not troll. Sterndrives are simply not intended to be used for trolling.

Tubing and knee boarding would be good. I don't think anyone in my family is going to ski except me, and their not going to drive the boat with me skiing anytime soon. Thanks for the video - looks like great fun.

 

[KStruglia]

On the 280--light tubing can be done. Skiing, like Presentation wrote is tough.

I am already looking at around 39' LOA at this time. A sedan Bridge would be preferred but not necessary.

Please however, don't go be me..this is just what the wife and I are talking about.

This year we spent a lot of time on the boat (Not as much as we would have liked--but a lot) and having guest on the boat--it got over crowded quickly. there were many times that I and a friend stood on the Swim platform (BTW--extended swim platform a must) for hours so my guest had comfort. I did not mind but an extra few feet of cockpit space would have been great. Also, the kids kept trying to control the swim platform and throw me in the water--good times.

Vince,

Now that's movin' up - 28' to 39'! You're not going to ski with that! I saw som good deals on BoatTrader for a 39 footer - Low 300's. Now that's a good deal if you're going to give up your house and live on the boat. (Hum? I wonder what school district the marina is in.)
Thanks,
Kraig

 

[MaddyDean]

Vince,

Now that's movin' up - 28' to 39'! You're not going to ski with that! I saw som good deals on BoatTrader for a 39 footer - Low 300's. Now that's a good deal if you're going to give up your house and live on the boat. (Hum? I wonder what school district the marina is in.)
Thanks,
Kraig

School District--LOL. My marina happens to be in the same school district.

ya, 39-foot but I don't see it happening for a couple of years unless these scratch-offs sitting in front of me next to my coffee come through.

It is just a thought and our plan is to winterize this year, ready her for next year (Already renewed the slip) and put her up for sale at a fair but firm price--see what happens and it may force our hand to buy bigger.

whether we sell or not, we are going to look for bigger, the funny part is that my wife wants bigger (I am talking about the boat) and I had to talk her down to the 39'--go figure.

right now its a pipe-dream but in two years the wife goes to work full time and we'll see what happens.

 

[ch435]

I have had several boats, but my 280 was my first twin engine one. I got the hang of docking pretty quick, I am sure you will too. You will appreciate the extra 12 inches of beam in a 280 over a 260. It is much more stable. I rarely use trim tabs.

We had no problem tubing with this boat. In fact, I used two tubes to pull four people all at once for the better part of an afternoon. The kids had a blast. If I can ever find someone to drive it, I intend to at least try skiing behind it. I'm a pretty decent skier, so if the boat can pull me up, I can ski behind it.

I am a casual fisher, but it is not bad to just stand on the swim platform and cast away in any direction.

 

[2005SR300DA]

The 280 is a nice boat. I learned twin engines pretty quickly. They make docking a breeze. I would never want to go back. I work for a marina on lake wallenpaupack, while we don't have any 280's we have a 260 and a 300. The 300 has twin 350 mags in it and i went 15 miles and only burned 6 gallons of gas at 3200rpm's and I was doing almost 32mph. If you are in south east pa you must check out Peters Marine, I worked for them in high school and they are great. They know there stuff and have been in business 50+ years.

 

[NorCal Boater]

I guess I will throw in a comment from the older/larger group. The boat....not me. (actually I guess it fits me now too)

I have been boating since I was 16 and my 1989 340 Sundancer is the first twin engine boat I have had. I moved up from a 26' single I/O to twin inboards.

First, there is nothing wrong with older boats....if you get the right boat. My twin 454s were low hour (400+) when we bought the boat 3 1/2 years ago and now just turned over 700. They run great. I can't tell you how much I paid for fuel last year because I quit tracking it. Insurance cost $600 per year. My covered slip here in Northern Cal is $4260/year. I have the boat hauled and bottom painted every 2 years at about $1000 per haul out. Normal maintenance is no diffeent than a twin engine boat 10-15 years newer except I don't have the expense and maintenance of outdrives. (change oil, trans fluid, wax, etc.)

But the boat is over 36' in length and 12' wide. It easily sleeps 4 adults in beds and has a cockpit that can seat 10. Other Sea Ray owners with newer boats look at ours and always comment on how much room it has.

Lastly, once you handle a boat with twin inboards, not twin I/Os, you will not want to go back.

My boat for sale for $39k. Thats a lot of boat for under $40K and there is still money left over for a 20' ski/fish boat.

 

[gsmallwood]

The 280 is a wonderful boat. Just remember, it's a play toy, you don't live on it very long.

 

[320Bob]

Kraig,
With four people you definitely want to go with the 280 over the 260 which has the same beam and length as my previous boat. Just not enough beam compared with the 280. I went with the 320 because I wanted V drives and the 280 only came with stern drives.

Another consideration that nobody has mentioned so far to address your docking concerns is find a marina that either has finger slips or center pilings separating the double slips. In either type of slip you don't have to worry about hitting your dockmate's boat or vice versa. It will greatly reduce your anxiety about docking if you have this type of slip set up. It has been a major decision criteria in picking both my current and new marina for next year.