Maneuverability

[christo15]

We've had our Sea Ray 320 Sundancer for just over a year now and have realized that it's very difficult to maneuver around the docks when there's a heavy breeze. So much so that I don't feel comfortable taking it out by myself and I hate that. How does the 320 compare to a boat like the 2006 290 Sundancer in terms of handling.

 

[IanBat]

Hi Christo,

What do you consider a heavy breeze?

Operating in a wind, takes a bit of practice and understanding. I have a 94 330 with I/O's, so a bit more difficult than V Drives. That being said, I control it fairly well with the motors.
A few things I have learned.
The nose is the first part to get caught, you can end up pivoting off the nose
Particularly if turning into the wind, I generally find i need mor RPM on the side in Reverse
Reversing into the wind, takes the wind off the nose and is easier

 

[Gofirstclass]

Christo, there are several factors that affect how a boat handles in the wind....obviously the strength of the wind, the angle of the wind, the "sail area" of the boat, the size/weight of the boat, size of the props, how far apart the props are. The list could go on but you get my drift (OK, that pun was REALLY bad!)

How your boat will handle also depends on whether you are backing to get into a slip or going in bow first. Same thing if you are trying to bring the boat to a side tie position.

If you're single handling and HAVE to get to a dock, perhaps there's another dock location in that same marina that could be easier to maneuver to. The wind can be your friend and can bring you to a dock, but it can also be a PITA if it's trying to keep you off a dock.

When I'm maneuvering in a wind I try to back upwind. At my slip, which is aligned E/W, the wind is almost always from the SW. It is also distorted by the boats that are in the adjacent slips and that makes if fun!

The first thing I do is try to determine how strong the wind is AT MY SLIP. Doesn't matter how strong it is 50' in front of the slip, what counts is what the wind is going to do to the boat as I'm entering the slip. I try to figure what the wind will be doing to the boat at the opening to the slip and back upwind until I get to that point and be prepared to change my direction of backing.

Obviously if you're heading down a fairway in a crosswind you want to be as close to the upwind side as possible. You can often just come to neutral, stop you forward momentum and let the wind carry you away from the upwind boats before you start your maneuvering. I don't want to be in the middle of a slip when there's a crosswind because it limits the amount of maneuvering room I'll have.

The biggest thing I've learned is that a LOT of practice is what helps the most. Take someone out with you when the wind is blowing so they can handle your dock lines for you. Just make sure your lines and fenders are all set before you even get close to the slip, and make sure your expectations are clearly explained to your dock line helper before you get to the slip. If there's any errors made on his part, as captain you have to assume that you didn't explain it clearly enough or didn't ask him to repeat your expectations to you so you know he understands what you want.

He shouldn't take offense at this. I do this with my wife all the time just so there are none of those "I thought you meant..." moments.

 

[Jimmy Buoy]

I had a similar feeling when I moved from a single I/O to twin V-Drives in a larger boat. Turned out my approach to docking was the problem since the two types of boats operate quite differently. Fortunately a fellow boater came to my aid and offered a half hour tutorial in water to help me. After seeing my attempt to dock he saw the problem right away. I was treating my twin inboard like a single I/O.

Basically, there were a lot of things that would be opposite from what I was used to...

Before docking centre the rudders and leave them there. When possible back into the wind. With a cross wind, back towards the wind at an angle reversing the engine closest to the wind which will also swing your bow into the wind. Make minor adjustments for the position of your stern to the finger dock by putting the other engine in forward from time to time. Don't leave either engine in gear too long, but take some breaks to see how the boat is reacting before re-engaging the props. All this being said, the stronger the wind is blowing, the more extreme should be your manoeuvring (i.e. more throttle along with bursts of forward or reverse)

Operating your boat is a mix of science and art. There are just so many factors, but there are some basic principles that cannot be ignored. The best advice I can offer is learn the basics then PRACTICE until you feel in control no matter what the conditions. Starting out away from the dock, perhaps near a buoy get used to how your boat will respond with different inputs from the shifters and throttles makes for a worry free start. As you become more familiar, move up to trying at a dock that doesn't have any neighbouring boats to damage (and take a friend to help prevent you from damaging yours on the dock itself).

With V-Drives, your boat should be quite good in dock manoeuvring. With practice I'm confident that you will discover just that!

 

[fwebster]

320DA's have small props and very small rudders. I think the answer to your handling issues is to learn to apply power in short bursts to see how the boat reacts to more water flow and thrust. Apply some rudder and a burst of power and you will be amazed at the increased control you get with more water flow over the rudders when just idle power and rudders straight ahead seems to do nothing.

 

[JimT]

I have never driven a 320DA but there are many of them on my dock. The owners seem to have very good control and easily back them into some pretty tight slips in all kinds of weather conditions. It sounds like you need more practice and possibly some instruction from a professional captain.

 

[Irie308]

This is our first year with our 320 as well and IMO it handles like a dream. We dock on the Housatonic River which has a decent current that used to give me the sweats when docking but after a few times out i noticed that she was very responsive to my inputs. Often time we are docking with the wind and current working against us. I've found that properly timed bursts of thrust and a bit of "wait and see" works every time. We also have a bow thruster that i could count on 1 hand how many times i've used it all season, mostly just to hold her against the finger while we untie the lines heading out.

 

[northern]

It all takes time to figure out things. Go practice in open water to a fixed point like a buoy (a plastic bottle in a tight string). Use cotton string so it will rot if you catch it on a prop.
Neutral helps bring the boat back to a stable point if you have room to drift a bit. We have enclosed upper helm and that catches a lot of wind. Once was told all new boats come with training paint. Do not be afraid to ask some one to catch a line.

 

[christo15]

Thanks for the help guys. I will plan to practice more come next season. Now I have another question. How do you all make sure to keep the rudders straight when docking? That's my biggest problem. I'm so used to outboards.

 

[strange weather]

I check the rudder position on my auto pilot screen- some make a mark on the steering wheel for quick reference-then keep your hands off the wheel and use forward/reverse-in most cases no throttle

 

[Do Over]

Thanks for the help guys. I will plan to practice more come next season. Now I have another question. How do you all make sure to keep the rudders straight when docking? That's my biggest problem. I'm so used to outboards.

simple enough....when your heading for your slip and your going straight....leave the wheel there and start driving the boat with the tranny shifters....at idle of course.

 

[christo15]

simple enough....when your heading for your slip and your going straight....leave the wheel there and start driving the boat with the tranny shifters....at idle of course.

Our port engine has been weaker than our starboard (currently getting it looked at) since day one. That could be part of the problem. But that's how we do it, make sure the boat is heading straight then let go of the wheel and use the shifters.

 

[Do Over]

Our port engine has been weaker than our starboard (currently getting it looked at) since day one. That could be part of the problem. But that's how we do it, make sure the boat is heading straight then let go of the wheel and use the shifters.

in my experience V-drives are very forgiving when it comes to rudder placement at idle....on my 340 I have to be running at least 1000-1100 rpm's before I can even steer with the rudders...under that there's not enough wash going past the rudders to matter.

 

[christo15]

in my experience V-drives are very forgiving when it comes to rudder placement at idle....on my 340 I have to be running at least 1000-1100 rpm's before I can even steer with the rudders...under that there's not enough wash going past the rudders to matter.

It's the same case with us. Attempting the use the rudders at low speeds is difficult.

 

[FootballFan]

its all about practice. Find a buoy somewhere and practice backing up to the buoy while keeping your bow pointed in a consistent direction. Pivot around to a different angle with the wind hitting you different. Learn how it feels in different wind directions.

 

[mquiet]

Some consistent themes here: practice around a buoy, when approaching your slip center rudders and use differential shifting and power. Don't be afraid to use bursts of throttle, just make sure power is down before shifting. Learn to use differential shifting and throttle power around a buoy. Once you can hold the boat on both sides, for and aft of a buoy docking will be easier.


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[IanBat]

There's a gauge you can buy that sticks onto the steering wheel. I had one I used religiously for over a year, until it fell off, by then I was used to the feeling of it, so knew where the legs were.

What I tend to do now, is pick a point when I am heading in, ensure I am going straight at that point, and then go to the sticks from then on.

I actually don't look at the wheel now, when I'm coming in, as the feeling has just become automatic


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[FootballFan]

First few times you use power as an aid, your not sure how much. Tough to learn next to the dock, that's why an open area is so good to practice in. Just make sure as you practice moving the stern, you are keeping the bow aligned on a landmark.