Looking for first boat, 24-29'

[adauphin]

As my first post, wanted to say hi and looks to be a wealth of info and friendship here.

Been on boats many times, never owned one..mainly contributed to fuel costs and helping clean. We had a boat growing up but I was in grade school, later years were friends' boats.

I had my eye on a 240 Sundancer back around 2004, then we had kids..lol, now they are in middle school and we are interested in pursuing one again.

I've had my eye on a few 280 Sundancers, circa 2001-2003. Seen a few with very low hours, one has the factory generator and has about 100 hours on the boat. That one has the single 7.4 and has not been run in about 1 year so obvious maintenance is mandatory.

How would the single 7.4 compare to twin 4.3's? Are both way underpowered or slightly....or possibly adequate?

What should I look for in these boats in terms of wear?

I understand a 9.5' beam boat is better kept in the water, but trailering is a possibility but likely not worth it. We live within 10 miles from a few marinas and the extra cost of keeping in the water would make much more sense.

We may stay overnight on it on occasion, but mainly a full-day trip in the hot, humid Mid-Atlantic area which begins the debate of bow-rider or cabin. I think the cabin would be a more welcome boat, just a big boat if we are pulling a tube at times.

All input and criticism appreciated.

 

[Gofirstclass]

First of all, welcome to CSR. There's a wealth of information available on here, just ask away.

For years I've told people who are looking for a first boat to buy their second boat first. By that, I mean that may people run out to buy a boat, fall in love with one and buy it. Then, after a year or two they realize it doesn't suit their needs. The kids got bigger or there are more kids in the family, but the boat no longer fits.

So they trade it in, taking a beating on the value, and buy their second boat--the one they should have bought first.

Take your time. Walk on lots of boats with your kids. See how it fits when you consider a cooler, the kids' friends, water skies or wakeboards, tubes, etc.

If you're looking at a 280, consider a 290 or 300. It might mean going a year or two older to stay within your budget, but you don't want to buy too small a boat.

 

[PMC]

That is vey good advice. Spend as much time on boats with the family aboard before committing to one. Making the decision to wet slip a boat vs trailering opens up many more options.

My previous boat was a 280DA with twin 4.3. The boat was not underpowered. Here is a little reading on that boat lol

http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php?threads/official-280-sundancer-thread.10064/

Just recently a thread popped up, talking about beam....you can read and decide for yourself. 9' 5" is good and all, but if you do not trailer, you can get a lot more boat.

http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php?threads/is-it-really-all-about-the-beam.93762/

This is also a good read, talking pros / cons of what some folks value....good for some perspective

http://www.clubsearay.com/index.php?threads/the-good-and-the-bad-about-your-current-boat.94094/

Good luck with the search!

 

[adauphin]

Thanks @Gofirstclass...that's great advice. I want to say I'm halfway there....after spending some search time on a 240 Sundancer, 2465 Commodore, and a 2660 Martinique, the 280 Sundancer with it's wider beam is where I was looking to move up to.

OTOH, with the prices of some boats I've seen, a 290 or 300 is an option if the price is right. What is also a factor is the fuel burn of the 30' boats and slip fees. I can get the same price for a 280 Sundancer as well as a boat with an OAL of 35' or less.

I haven't researched propulsion and fuel burn of a 30' boat yet. Might not be as bad as I think compared to a 280.

Moving around on a 280 is far more enjoyable than the 240 with 4-6 people.

 

[Strecker25]

Thanks @Gofirstclass...that's great advice. I want to say I'm halfway there....after spending some search time on a 240 Sundancer, 2465 Commodore, and a 2660 Martinique, the 280 Sundancer with it's wider beam is where I was looking to move up to.

OTOH, with the prices of some boats I've seen, a 290 or 300 is an option if the price is right. What is also a factor is the fuel burn of the 30' boats and slip fees. I can get the same price for a 280 Sundancer as well as a boat with an OAL of 35' or less.

I haven't researched propulsion and fuel burn of a 30' boat yet. Might not be as bad as I think compared to a 280.

Moving around on a 280 is far more enjoyable than the 240 with 4-6 people.

Our 98 290 has twin 5.7’s and a 10’3” beam. The same boat was made up through 2001, might be worth a look.

We run around 1.5mpg at cruise, so fuel burn is not bad at all. Believe me, you’ll never say you have too much power.

Enjoy the search, it’s a lot of fun

 

[adauphin]

@PMC we must have replied at the same time...I'll check out those links.

We run around 1.5mpg at cruise, so fuel burn is not bad at all. Believe me, you’ll never say you have too much power.

1.5 MPG isn't terrible for that setup, I'll expand my search. Of course a 10.3' beam is reaching past towing back and forth to the house.... But I understand that kind of boat stays in the water.

 

[Gofirstclass]

I haven't researched propulsion and fuel burn of a 30' boat yet. Might not be as bad as I think compared to a 280.

I think most boaters would agree that fuel costs are among the smallest expenses of owning a boat...unless you're putting hundreds of hours on it every year, and the chances of doing that are three: Slim, None and Zilch.

 

[Strecker25]

I think most boaters would agree that fuel costs are among the smallest expenses of owning a boat...unless you're putting hundreds of hours on it every year, and the chances of doing that are three: Slim, None and Zilch.

I always said if we ever look back on the previous year in january and wish we didn’t fill the boat up that one last time...we must have had a hell of a year.

 

[adauphin]

I think most boaters would agree that fuel costs are among the smallest expenses of owning a boat

Absolutely. I’d be more apt to spend more on a reliable and well-maintained engine/drive and electrical than the cost of fuel.

I always said if we ever look back on the previous year in january and wish we didn’t fill the boat up that one last time...we must have had a hell of a year.

I completely agree. Not going to let a tank of fuel keep us from going out for the day.

I just wish the 280DA had a larger tank. Maybe 125-140 gal but still not a deal breaker. Granted that would come with a weight penalty, but I’m sure 100 gal will be plenty.

 

[adauphin]

I looked at a buddies 01' 280DA this weekend and overall it's in great shape but have a few questions regarding course of action.

The boat has roughly 60 total hrs on it, been in water most of it's life with little use. Was professionally winterized in the late fall of 2017 and hasn't been ran since, boat also has factory generator.

Bottom paint doesn't look too bad but is smooth and could use a re-paint. The drive has slight seepage at the top, not sure what's under there that leaks but I don't mind getting dirty. I've been wrenching cars most of my life and am mechanically inclined, however if this is best left to the pros I'm fine with that. Lower unit has what appears to be corrosion at the very bottom, I assume to remedy this the complete lower portion will need to be replaced?

Again, all insight, criticism is greatly appreciated.

 

[Woody]

How much $$$ he asking? Trailer?

 

[adauphin]

No trailer unfortunately, haven't discussed pricing but I'm guessing anywhere between $25-35K

 

[adauphin]

Within this area I've seen quite a few 28-30' cruisers in that price range, the 30'ers generally around 32-38K with some hours on them.

When I say $25-35K, numbers have been thrown around and I think $35-38K on the higher side but unsure of what I need to bring this up to ready status. How much work do I need on the drive in regards to seals and hoses, bellows etc.
..can I do this myself nor need a shop? Very few hours but still 18 YO, I think the lower unit was replaced once from corrosion.

 

[Golfman25]

That outdrive looks like it's seen better days. I don't know if in 2001 they where still having corrosion issues -- you might want to google around a bit.

In your size range, as a first boat, I would look at as late model 260 sundancer as I could find. They seem pretty popular.

 

[adauphin]

I hear ya about the drive, it's the only part that has me the most concerned. I would speculate it would be wise to replace the seals, hoses, bellows, etc but haven't searched all the costs.

The engine and drive are original with about 55 hours total. I guess it depends on what the selling price is....tough call, the cabin looks and smells brand new.

 

[Golfman25]

I hear ya about the drive, it's the only part that has me the most concerned. I would speculate it would be wise to replace the seals, hoses, bellows, etc but haven't searched all the costs.

The engine and drive are original with about 55 hours total. I guess it depends on what the selling price is....tough call, the cabin looks and smells brand new.

A 2001 with 55 hours is bad news IMO. I would rather have more hours on a well maintained engine/outdrive. That boat spent more time just sitting. Engines/outdrives don't like to sit. They'll just rot away without use. When was the last time the outdrive was serviced -- that might tell you something.

 

[adauphin]

I would rather have more hours on a well maintained engine/outdrive

I agree completely. I will get the service history and let you know. From what I understand, it was used at least a weekend a month for a few hours during the regular season.never sat for extreme extended times...like 6 months,.was also winterized each year.

Still...it did sit and would require an extensive checkup. I wish it had 300 hours and was currently in use, and could be the deal breaker.

 

[ColoSR]

Can you get a mechanic or surveyor to look at it? You have a huge potential range, maybe $2k to scrape and paint to $15k if you need major work on the Bravo III drive and transom assembly. All of the bolts are rusted or frozen on underwater parts, so repairs take way longer than a car for similar tasks and used parts are generally in poor condition.

On the plus side, parts are still available from mercruiser so you can maintain it.

 

[JimT]

I looked at a buddies 01' 280DA this weekend and overall it's in great shape but have a few questions regarding course of action.

The boat has roughly 60 total hrs on it, been in water most of it's life with little use. Was professionally winterized in the late fall of 2017 and hasn't been ran since, boat also has factory generator.

Bottom paint doesn't look too bad but is smooth and could use a re-paint. The drive has slight seepage at the top, not sure what's under there that leaks but I don't mind getting dirty. I've been wrenching cars most of my life and am mechanically inclined, however if this is best left to the pros I'm fine with that. Lower unit has what appears to be corrosion at the very bottom, I assume to remedy this the complete lower portion will need to be replaced?

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Again, all insight, criticism is greatly appreciated.

No way I would buy a boat that has seen an average 3 hours use each year. You are just asking for trouble. There are many well maintained 280DA's out there. The 280DA was one of Sea Ray's most successful models with a long production run.

 

[ColoSR]

Either way, just make sure you go in with eyes wide open. You are looking at 18 year old boats, and even well maintained boats have things break on a maddeningly regular basis.

That being said, boats that need major maintenance sell at a heavily discounted rate compared to well maintained analogues. Mine had an issue with the transom assembly, and I got it through a broker for 50% of the cost of the well maintained option. After having the mechanic put in a new transom assembly from Mercruiser, alternator, and a lot of sweat equity on small stuff, I was still $7K in the black.

If you want a fair deal, you could get a boat broker involved. That way your buddy hears from a third party that his boat is nowhere near the $27.5-$31.5K NADA Retail value. That and some feedback from your mechanic could put you in the ballpark. It will cost some money, but make sure the mechanic pulls the drive, checks the compression, and the elbows.

If you do decide to pick it up, I would replace the alternator and starter as part of your refurbishment work. They are both cheap, don't react well to marine environments, and can leave you stranded.