Is There A Way To Test Vessels To See If They Are Compatible With New Marina Electrical Standards?

[MonacoMike]

The title says it all? Or do you just have to go to one and find out the hard way?

Mine works fine but friends with older boats are pondering this as some states have mandated marinas meet this standard in the next couple of years...

 

[ranger58sb]

Some marinas have test boxes, or you can hire a local marine electrician... who has the proper test equipment.

Boats with isolation transformers seem to be OK, and boats without inverter seem to fare OK too. Some inverter installations seem to work, some don't. And then there are all the other possible (non-inverter) causes...

We're not seeing marinas rush out there to update; we've mostly only seen the new EFCI pedestals at marinas that had to do electrical work for other reasons... like replacing a dock after weather damage and so forth.

-Chris

 

[Stee6043]

Perhaps a silly question...but what new standards? I've heard that some area marinas have started to crack down on using Y-splitters due to some interference with proper GFCI function? But otherwise I haven't heard of any other big changes coming...yet. Do tell!

 

[Njlarry]

No idea about the new standards but simple way to test for AC current leaks is to just put a clamp on induction amp meter around your power cable. Meter should read zero as current goining in on black wire should equal current returning on white wire.

 

[ranger58sb]

Perhaps a silly question...but what new standards?

I don't know the metrics, but it's stated as something like less than XXX millivolts (or some such) differential between positive and neutral current... or else the breaker trips. (I dunno the actual value of XXX, just now.)

We've seen potential issues at some marinas with the new pedestal breakers (previous boat, with an inverter installation) for maybe the last 3 years or so... and I guess that means the "new" standard is actually something like 4 years old by now. I didn't get around to fully troubleshooting our installation...

-Chris

 

[ttmott]

I think you will find that NFPA 70 changes for ground fault protection in marinas was adopted in 2017 yet only applicable to new construction and not existing installations. However, I have heard that many existing marinas updated to comply with insurance mandates or to lower insurance rates.
This thread appears to be regarding boat compatibility with with marina dock electrical systems which have installed Marina Ground Fault Protection per the NFPA 70 (National Electrical Code) will trip when an electrical leakage of 30 milliamps or greater is detected. Electrical leakage is that electrical current that does not return on the power conductors but rather leaks either to the ground conductor or elsewhere like the water.
There are two ways a boat can be faulted or mis-wired and cause an imbalance of power fed and returned to the marina. One is there is truly a fault and power is being shorted to ground. Water heaters are notorious when the heating element breaks down and current begins to shunt to the ground.
The second is the neutral (white) conductors are tied to the boat's ground and/or bonding system. Boats since before the 70's have had separate neutral and ground systems so to say that it is the boat manufacturer's problem would be in error.
Boats with generators have shore power switching that switch both the "hot" conductors as well as the "neutral" conductors. This is because when the boat is operating on generator power the generator as a power source must bond the neutral with both the boat's ground wiring and boat's bonding wiring.
Boats with inverters if installed correctly also must switch the hot conductors as well as the neutral conductors as like a generator the inverter is classified as a power source.
Boats with isolation transformers are rather unique in that they are classified as power sources but also source power from the marina's electrical system. As a transformer there is no copper path between the boat's electrical system and the marina's electrical system consequently, the boat must stand alone and tie together the boat's neutral conductors with the ground and bonding conductors at all times.
The bottom line is if a boat is tripping the marina's GFI there is a problem with the boat. With that then there is a safety hazard and it must be corrected.

 

[MonacoMike]

Perhaps a silly question...but what new standards? I've heard that some area marinas have started to crack down on using Y-splitters due to some interference with proper GFCI function? But otherwise I haven't heard of any other big changes coming...yet. Do tell!

I think this explains what the changes are. I have read that Michigan is going to require that within a couple of years.

https://www.marinadockage.com/technical-bulletin-electrical-changes-marina-code/

I know for certain that Petoskey and South Haven Michigan have have updated their systems.

 

[ttmott]

I think you will find that NFPA 70 changes for ground fault protection in marinas was adopted in 2017 yet only applicable to new construction and not existing installations. However, I have heard that many existing marinas updated to comply with insurance mandates or to lower insurance rates.
This thread appears to be regarding boat compatibility with with marina dock electrical systems which have installed Marina Ground Fault Protection per the NFPA 70 (National Electrical Code) will trip when an electrical leakage of 30 milliamps or greater is detected. Electrical leakage is that electrical current that does not return on the power conductors but rather leaks either to the ground conductor or elsewhere like the water.
There are two ways a boat can be faulted or mis-wired and cause an imbalance of power fed and returned to the marina. One is there is truly a fault and power is being shorted to ground. Water heaters are notorious when the heating element breaks down and current begins to shunt to the ground.
The second is the neutral (white) conductors are tied to the boat's ground and/or bonding system. Boats since before the 70's have had separate neutral and ground systems so to say that it is the boat manufacturer's problem would be in error.
Boats with generators have shore power switching that switch both the "hot" conductors as well as the "neutral" conductors. This is because when the boat is operating on generator power the generator as a power source must bond the neutral with both the boat's ground wiring and boat's bonding wiring.
Boats with inverters if installed correctly also must switch the hot conductors as well as the neutral conductors as like a generator the inverter is classified as a power source.
Boats with isolation transformers are rather unique in that they are classified as power sources but also source power from the marina's electrical system. As a transformer there is no copper path between the boat's electrical system and the marina's electrical system consequently, the boat must stand alone and tie together the boat's neutral conductors with the ground and bonding conductors at all times.
The bottom line is if a boat is tripping the marina's GFI there is a problem with the boat. With that then there is a safety hazard and it must be corrected.

So, to test -
On your shore power cord (connected to the boat but not the marina) with the boat configured for shore power connect a digital volt meter set to resistance between the "hot" receptacle lead (plug spade) and the "ground" spade - you should read in the mega-ohms to infinity. Do the same between the "neutral" spade and "ground" spade - you should also read in the mega-ohms to infinity.
Then in the boat behind the circuit breaker panel with the shore power cord disconnected from the marina and the boat configured to shore power measure between the "neutral" buss bar (white wires) and the "ground" buss bar (green wires) - you should again read in the mega-ohms to infinity.
Lastly, if your boat has two 30 amp shore power connections then you need to do the above testing on both but also between the two "neutral" buss bars - there should be no continuity across the neutrals; the neutrals must remain isolated to their source power cord.
Hopefully that helps a bit....

 

[spikedaddy99]

I finally learned what all of my settings are on my voltmeter.

 

[Stee6043]

I think this explains what the changes are. I have read that Michigan is going to require that within a couple of years.

https://www.marinadockage.com/technical-bulletin-electrical-changes-marina-code/

I know for certain that Petoskey and South Haven Michigan have have updated their systems.

South Haven was the place I referenced above. I stayed there 3 nights this year. Prior to arriving I had to buy two 50A to 30A pigtails, they no longer allow 50A to (2) 30A splitters. They indicated it was due to how it impacts GFCI functionality. It's an easy...albeit $250...fix.

 

[ttmott]

So, to test -
On your shore power cord (connected to the boat but not the marina) with the boat configured for shore power connect a digital volt meter set to resistance between the "hot" receptacle lead (plug spade) and the "ground" spade - you should read in the mega-ohms to infinity. Do the same between the "neutral" spade and "ground" spade - you should also read in the mega-ohms to infinity.
Then in the boat behind the circuit breaker panel with the shore power cord disconnected from the marina and the boat configured to shore power measure between the "neutral" buss bar (white wires) and the "ground" buss bar (green wires) - you should again read in the mega-ohms to infinity.
Lastly, if your boat has two 30 amp shore power connections then you need to do the above testing on both but also between the two "neutral" buss bars - there should be no continuity across the neutrals; the neutrals must remain isolated to their source power cord.
Hopefully that helps a bit....

I should clarify that this testing is applicable only if your boat does not have an Isolation Transformer. If you do have an Isolation Transformer then you should have close to zero ohms between the neutral (white wire) buss bar behind the circuit breaker panel and the ground/bonding buss bar (green wires). Actually, in fact, there should be a jumper bar between the two buss bars if you have an isolation transformer.

 

[MonacoMike]

South Haven was the place I referenced above. I stayed there 3 nights this year. Prior to arriving I had to buy two 50A to 30A pigtails, they no longer allow 50A to (2) 30A splitters. They indicated it was due to how it impacts GFCI functionality. It's an easy...albeit $250...fix.

I was trying to remember if I used the 50 splitter or two 30 on the pedastal in SH recently. No one said anything.