How many of you own a mooring?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by mnm99, Jan 18, 2018.

  1. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    Mooring.jpg Who know the weight a mooring can hold for real? I own a 500lb mooring and used to be able to raft 3 boats without a problem. As of this year all the rules are changing and may cost me a fortune. I would have to buy a 1000lb mooring in order to raft the same 3 boats. I'm wondering the physics behind how a mooring will securely hold a boat works. Over the years I never had a problem no matter what size boat I had rafted. Whats your input on this? Yea..The letter says Happy New year...Whatever..
    When I get home I'll post a picture of the letter I got.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2018
  2. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    I've been using moorings on countless boats my whole life on the coast of Maine... and Uncles and Grandfather before me. The thing is, there are SO many variables that there is no way to give a specific answer... Type of ground tackle (anchor/weight/bottom chain), type of top chain/rope, bottom composition, depth, tidal flow, winds, currents, etc, etc.

    But, as an example, my most recent setup is a 400lb Dor-mor in 40' (high tide), with 40' of 1-1/4" bottom chain (that's 1-1/4" DIAMETER steel), 40' of 1/2" chain and 40' of 7/8" rope. That would hold your boat in a big storm without even budging. The bottom conditions are mud/shell and allow the anchor to bury itself very well. In most conditions, the anchor doesn't even get pulled on at all - it sits there nice an quietly, bored from non-use.
     
  3. reddog0216

    reddog0216 New Member

    5
    Jan 15, 2018
    Mt Siani Long Island NY
    380 Sundancer 2000
    454's V-drives
    I moor My Boat in Mt Sinai but I just upgraded to a 380 so i am going to need a bigger mooring. We typically Raft up 5 boats ranging in size from 31 to a 42 without a issue on a 600lb mooring. I am curious what new laws you have seen and where you are located
     
  4. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    See my first most. I updated it..I'm in the Cove. It says we can never raft more than 3. SO far I found out my 34' Is good with the 500lb and 1 other boat. They don't say how big though. As far as I know it could be a 50ft.. But yet a friend who owns a 31 foot boat can raft 3 without a problem. I think they are making it that it cant be over the size of the original boat on the mooring. Either way there are many of us that aren't happy. They are saying it's all for safety...It's gonna cost $750 to install it in the spring and $750 to pull it in the fall plus the initial $1500+ for the mooring!!!...Double what were paying now........
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2018
  5. dcpringle

    dcpringle Member

    442
    Dec 13, 2012
    CT River
    2000 Sea Ray 480DB "Diamond Girl"
    Cat 3196 660HP
    As others have said, it depends on the area. I have one for my boat as well, it's in Hamburg Cove off the CT river. We've had 5 boats on it, and it's considered a hurricane hole. However, it's only 250lbs. I was going to purchase a larger one but the harbor master said it would be overkill.
     
  6. Gary B

    Gary B Member

    167
    May 20, 2015
    Long Island
    2007 52 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSM 11
    Is the Cove "pirates cove" in Port Jefferson?
     
  7. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    Yes
     
  8. northern

    northern Well-Known Member

    Jan 17, 2007
    West coast Vancouver to Alaska
    380 Aft Cabin 1989 GPS and Charts by Nobeltec
    Twin 454 strait shaft
    We boat in Washington some times. The state has many parks with buoys. On the buoys they state the boat size and how many boats can be moored to it. Based on that there has to be an engineering formula they use to set the capacity of a mooring buoy. If your state has them in parks perhaps they could give you the formula they use to set mooring capacity. If not ask the Washington State parks department.
     
  9. be_prepared

    be_prepared Active Member GOLD Sponsor

    237
    Oct 12, 2015
    Mattapoisett, MA
    2002 Sea Ray Sundancer 340DA
    Twin Mercruiser Horizon 8.1 inboards
    Interesting discussion. I kinda assume virtually all harbors have regulations/guidelines for their boating community regarding moorings. In our harbor, there are very specific minimum requirements based on boat size. We have to have inspections done by certified marine services every other year with photos and an inspection certificate filed with the town harbormaster. Over the years, and a few hurricanes they got serious about it.

    The regulations specify weight of mushroom or pyramid to be LOD(ft) x beam(ft) x 1.5 lbs (LOD length on deck). For deadweight moorings, it’s double that.
    They also specify 3 levels of chain, for example, boats 36-45ft need 1 1/2” bottom (navy) chain, 1” intermediate chain, and 5/8” top chain. The lengths required vary based on high water depth.
    Minimum pennant for 25-36’ is 3/4” nylon 3 strand. Over 36’ requires 1”. They even specify minimum chafe gear on the pennant.

    It’s expensive to pay for the inspection every 2 years. We used to be able to dive on them and “self inspect”, but you can imagine how many folks took advantage of that and didn’t do it. You then have a storm blow thru, and boats breaks lose, hitting others as they go adrift thru the harbor driven by the storm. Lotta property damage from people with undersized and/or poorly maintained gear.
     
  10. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    We only have one company that can install and remove them. Pretty much a monopoly and don't have a choice. They are installed and pulled every season and they follow there standards. We have no say in the regulations. As northern mentioned, I'm curious of the formula they are using? So far it only looks like length. This I can't understand. I own a 34ft that weighs 16,000lb and is low to the water. My friend had a 32ft Bridge boat that weighs 20,000lbs and has much more pulling force because of his height. BUT...He can get away with a 500lb mooring and I need a 1000lb....
     
  11. Woody

    Woody Well-Known Member

    Nov 20, 2007
    N. Wisconsin/Lk Superior
    2005 420DA
    Cummins 6CTA8.3
    It's not as if their rules/moorings are designed for any 'specific' 3 boats. Somehow they have to have all combinations covered.

    It makes it harder to take when you keep comparing boats that are just barely on each side of the 32' line. Remember your boat is really 37'6" and then it won't hurt so much.
     
  12. Lazy Daze

    Lazy Daze Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Apr 21, 2009
    PA
    Various
    Various
    And, you could have a longer, heavier sailboat on a mooring... yet it would "pull" less than a shorter, lighter powerboat. Lot's of combos - too many for any one entity to get (or want) involved with.

    Disregard my first post - I thought you were interested in how to build a mooring yourself, until you posted later and added the picture.
     
  13. FootballFan

    FootballFan Well-Known Member

    Jun 20, 2012
    Florida
    Marquis 59
    MTU Series 60
    We have taken bare boat trips the last two years to the San Juan islands.

    Discovered the mooring balls do not have a leader (at least the ones we grabbed). The mooring lines (not sure if that is the correct term) are cool.
     
  14. b_arrington

    b_arrington Active Member

    603
    Feb 21, 2007
    Setauket, NY
    270 Amberjack (2006)
    AB Ventus 9 VL RIB
    350 Mag MPI Horizon w/ BIII
    1998 Envinrude 15 HP 2-stroke
    I'm in Setauket, so am subject to the same Town of Brookhaven mooring regulations as you. I use 2 moorings: 1 that is rented as part of my seasonal service, and 1 owned that gets dropped in the NW mooring area. My mooring installer feels that the Town's rules related mooring weights and rafting are ill-conceived and not based on any verifiable standard. Basically, the Town picked a number out of the hat with regard to mooring weights for rafts.

    The irony is that since the Town enacted the upper limit of 3 boats per mooring (with special permit), I've NEVER seen the rule enforced. Last year there were massive raft-ups in Port Jeff of 15-20 boats on a single mooring. The harbor master never bothered them; they just went after the few jetskiers that were pretty much minding their own business.
     
  15. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    I'm not saying anything bad, but the Harbormaster is new. I'll leave it at that... That's all I'll say for now. This whole thing doesn't make sense. I was told it was for safety over and over. The problem is I asked what kind of safety concerns do they have? Never get an answer.... So Murphys is putting yours in too then. This year they are putting colored stickers on all the moorings telling them the weight. Then they look at the boat size and give you a ticket accordingly. I just called my friend. He has a 34ft Mainship that weighs 20,500lb dry. Now with a 500lb mooring him and myself( 15,500lb) can raft with a total of around 36,000lbs. But myself (15,500lb) can't raft 2 of my buddies that have 5,000lb boats. That's a total of 25,500lbs...THAT'S NO OKAY. I'm trying to find out what there formula is when they figure out what's needed. I already talked to my Councilwoman, Public safety and got nowhere. She told me to talk to the Harbormaster.. They don't make the rule's though. Public safety does I was told.
     
  16. Air O'Nautical

    Air O'Nautical Active Member

    Feb 5, 2008
    Stamford CT "Ponus Yacht Club"
    1995 400EC. Raymarine E80,4kw dome, Garmin 235 gps,
    2013 7.4L Mercruiser Blue water.
    Hurth straight shaft 630's,
    Westerbeke 7.0 BCG
    I’ve been hassled in several different places about rafting more than 3 boats on a mooring.
    We are just hanging out for the day in calm weather.

    The trick or workaround is to have the excess boats drop their anchors while still rafted to you.
    This is just for “show” purposes only :)
    Don’t let them actually hit bottom and set or you’ll be in a twisted mess!

    I sorta learned this from the Harbor Master.
    He insisted any boat over the limit must have an anchor down.....he didn’t say it had to hit the bottom!

    Now when he motors by us he see more than enough anchor lines in the water and doesn’t bother us anymore.

    ;)
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2018
  17. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    Nope. They got that one figured out too. Not allow to anchor any closer than 50ft to any mooring. Not allowed to drop anchor when connected to a mooring.
     
  18. b_arrington

    b_arrington Active Member

    603
    Feb 21, 2007
    Setauket, NY
    270 Amberjack (2006)
    AB Ventus 9 VL RIB
    350 Mag MPI Horizon w/ BIII
    1998 Envinrude 15 HP 2-stroke
    No, I use someone else.

    Send a message to Supervisor Romaine. I have found him quite responsive. Who is your Councilperson?
     
  19. mnm99

    mnm99 Well-Known Member

    Oct 2, 2015
    Long Island
    2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Merc
    Romaine won't help. I talked to Bonner. See.. I don't have a choice who put's mine in. He has it locked up. The cost now is $325 and will go up to $750 if I do the 1000lb.
     
  20. Henry Boyd

    Henry Boyd Well-Known Member

    Apr 24, 2007
    Newburyport, on the peaceful and serene Merrimack
    02' 280 DA
    496 w BIII
    Guys,

    Keep in mind the weight on land may be different for the underwater weight. A solid concrete block can weigh 33% less underwater due to trapped air. Also weight alone may not be the only factor. Where the low tide depth is greater than 10’ we can use mushroom anchors. These may only where 200 to 300 pounds, but once they sink into the bottom the effective strength is much higher.

    On our mooring I have a 1600 pound granite block on the bow and a 1000 pound block loading the stern down. We have two because our mooring is in a channel
     

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