Fuel Prices!

I thought that I read, just a week ago, that U.S. refinery exports, are higher than they have ever been in history....welcome to globalization....
 
it seems, we are being pushed into this new "soup" of civilization, and, the value of everything is being determined "globally".....it is fortunate we are living in the U.S., but, "large" money, has a staggering influence on our "elected" legislators, and, legislation that benefits a multinational is not necessarily in the best interest of individuals, particularly, a populace who still believes the "Declaration of Independence", "U.S. Constitution" and "Bill of Rights" are real........
 
CV-23 said:
I can agree what you are saying but the Middle Class is going broke. I didn't spend $40,000 on my boat and I like to entertain on it but the days of just taking folks for boat rides are over. The CV-23 still works for that at 4.5mpg! My wife/children (19 & 22) and myself enjoy family time and that includes their boyfriend/girlfriend on the 270DA. They understand the costs and it's not just some big toy to play with. I always get a gasp when someone asks about the mpg and I say 2! That's a $40-$50 20 mile boat ride. Those are facts we can not ignore. Fuel is my biggest expense since docking and storage is 1/2 of that where we live. Yes I have three beautiful classic boats and maintain them all myself but I have three jobs that foot the bills created by an out of control Federal & State Govt that now lets the world rule us, Mike.
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I guess my initial thought is, if I had to worry about a $50 gas bill for a weekend boat ride, I would not need to question the price of gas, but instead the concept of boat ownership itself and whether it was right for me. Still how much of your 3 jobs is down to poor government, on which I do totally agree, and how much is down to the fact you have 3 boats??
 
sfergson727 said:
Again, look at the big picture. This isn't an issue of the poor boaters complaining, this affects everyone, from the teen working in the grocery store to the dude in the 480 Sedan Bridge. When the price of oil goes up, it drives the price of everything else up too. Anyone notice how expensive groceries are becoming? How about clothing, building materials?
We are not simply complaining that go go juice is too pricey, it goes way deeper than that.
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Oil is a finite resource, there are only so many dead dinosaurs. There are now over 7 billion people in the world, 500 million Chinese who all want Buicks. The stuff is going up, there is nothing you or I can do about it, and its going to go up regardless of energy policy, good or bad, although I will concede poor policy will accelerate the process. As the price of everything goes up, eventually so does your salary, though there is a pretty significant lag between the two. My house cost $16,000 when it was new in 1952, it cost me $240,000 when I bought it, itll cost someone $500,000 when I sell it, but the "value" of the thing relative to my income or the income of the guy who bought it in 1952 new hasn't really changed.

The teen working in the grocery store makes triple what I made in the same grocery store 25 years ago, so what if his gas tripled too?
 
Turtlesboat said:
The only thing that is cheap on my boat is grilling steaks on my magma.
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If you got a Solaire grill, you could change that. And they'll taste right.

And if you think fuel is expensive, you should check out the tickets on Broadway. Getting 6 tickets to The Book of Mormon for the weekend in July of the sea ray snob rendezvous required me to sell my 2 cats. I think we should stop exporting our plays. For example, Jersey Boys is playing in London and all over the world now and the prices here are just skyrocketing.
 
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6019739/ns/business-oil_and_energy/t/us-refiners-stretch-meet-demand/ of course demand could be met easily, prices would decline if we stopped refiners from making their product the number one export. It's like we are starving for food and they export ALL of the wheat.

No new refineries since 76. Yes the existing refineries have modernized and became more efficient but all this just so the fat cat oil companies can make their production "the largest single export of the USA." Now why would our government halt expansion of new pipelines and drilling? Remember the president told Brazil we want to be your best customer!! What is the plan ? I can't come to any real conclusion except we are heading in the wrong direction with energy and like the vast majority of Americans our lives are going to "change" and we are helpless to correct it. Our elected leaders forget who put them in office!!
 
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As Last Dollar mentioned, the last grassroots refinery was built in the 70's. The cost of permitting by the EPA will forever halt building a new refinery. Most refinery growth is minimal for the same reasons. Most expansion is to meet EPA requirements i.e. low sulfur in diesel and gasoline and air standards. This adds to the cost of refining a barrel of oil. Why do you think oil companies partner up with companies in other countries? No EPA. We are the most regulated country in the world by far. The EPA doles out new regulations and tighter specifications constantly. The oil company has to pay billions to hire engineers to figure how to meet these standards then they have to buy the equipment and build the facilities to treat their products so they can sell them. Refiners either fork out the money to meet the regs or run until the government fines make them non profitable and shut the doors. We have "big oil" now because the little guys went tits up or were bought out to create "big oil". It sucks that gas prices are this high, but we are in a vicious circle with governmental policy. What do you do?
 
It's simply amazing that people on this board actually think the government should dictate to a private business (i.e. a refiner) where they can sell their products. The government doesn't own oil or refined products so to say the "U.S. is exporting (insert item here)" is really misleading. COMPANIES are exporting stuff... COMPANIES that have other people willing to pay a hirer price. COMPANIES that create jobs here in the US because they are doing stuff for overseas markets.

I got it... let's have the government crack down on these bastard companies and block them from shipping any product overseas. That'll make them lower their price here. Huh? How does that work?

I want a new SUV but they are too expensive. I think the government should block GM from shipping them to China so GM will be forced to sell them cheaper in the US. Right?
 
Dsybok said:
I guess my initial thought is, if I had to worry about a $50 gas bill for a weekend boat ride, I would not need to question the price of gas, but instead the concept of boat ownership itself and whether it was right for me. Still how much of your 3 jobs is down to poor government, on which I do totally agree, and how much is down to the fact you have 3 boats??
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I've owned boats for over 30 years so it's not some new hobby. The shame is it takes three jobs to stay middle class. One business I own and numbers are down due to the ecomomy, second job is local taxpayer driven and they are broke as we all know. Third job is running the Gas Dock at our club and being the full time Treasurer. I see money flow from 200 members and all have some issues with the ecomomy being down. I'm debt free so I've managed my income well. Home, 5 vehicles, 3 boats, etc. I see others hurting due to high fuel prices and it forces me to redirect income to make my hobbies happen. One ride does not make a day or weekend ($200 does) and it does not break me but I can show my displeasure with fuel increases that grow quicker than income. If the world is as broke as the US......I guess they still have $$$ to drive oil prices up. Maybe if we the US did not bail them out and give them our drilling technology and protect them from Iran etc, we would not be broke. Why do we give money to China anyways and borrow from them at the same time? I guess we should price wheat, corn & soybeans the same as oil. Let the wars continue on Food & Oil. They hate the US anyways...Mike.
 
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Four Suns said:
I want a new SUV but they are too expensive. I think the government should block GM from shipping them to China so GM will be forced to sell them cheaper in the US. Right?
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Actually GM does not ship many of them over there....GM's biggest selling cars in China are Buicks.....why you ask, because the emperor owned one many years ago, so its a status symbol. GM opened a second plant in 2009 there that make Chevy Cruze's. Not much demand for SUV's.... and the price has nothing to do with where they make them, unless your talking about shipping charges.

As for gas prices.....not sure about your states, but here in Michigan, gas has dropped like a rock....bought a tankful last night $3.18 a gallon....nice!! Refiners raise and lower the prices not so much on demand as they used to, but just because someone somewhere said something or some stupid report about God knows what. In otherwords whenever they feel like it....

If you have to ask the price then you can't aford it.....
 
Sea Ray 215 said:
and the price has nothing to do with where they make them, unless your talking about shipping charges.
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Exactly! So if I own a refinery, screw it! I'll build another one in Mexico and fire all the workers in the US because of all the b!tching about "exporting products". Then I'll ship the refined products back to the US... and everyone will be happier because more people are unemployed.

If I make a medical something, like a drug, and risk $$$Millions, and then there is some HUGE demand, are you all saying the company is bound to sell them in US only or sell them globally to who pays the most? Fine... I'll make the stuff in Mexico... keep the jobs and profits down there... everyone is happy now.

I remember back in the 90's and early 2000 time frame doubling the price of our software over in Europe compared to the US... why? Because we could...

Maybe the government should just own everything... that'll motivate people.
 
Four Suns said:
It's simply amazing that people on this board actually think the government should dictate to a private business (i.e. a refiner) where they can sell their products. The government doesn't own oil or refined products so to say the "U.S. is exporting (insert item here)" is really misleading. COMPANIES are exporting stuff... COMPANIES that have other people willing to pay a hirer price. COMPANIES that create jobs here in the US because they are doing stuff for overseas markets.

I got it... let's have the government crack down on these bastard companies and block them from shipping any product overseas. That'll make them lower their price here. Huh? How does that work?

I want a new SUV but they are too expensive. I think the government should block GM from shipping them to China so GM will be forced to sell them cheaper in the US. Right?
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Crap, I agree with Gary.... I hate when that happens!
 
You know what? I'm starting to change my mind. I've got so much coin dumped into software from Mathworks (MatLab) that I think the government should tell them what they can charge. It pisses me off these software companies just charge craploads of money for a "copy" of something. Greedy Bastards.

And look at Intel. Those evil capitalists charge extreme amounts of money and get all kinds of profits from making CPU's.... and we couldn't live without them anymore! Imagine life with no computers and networks!!! The government should shut them down!!!!! They are exporting all kinds of stuff and I'm paying thousands of dollars for these multi-core CPUs!!! They should make them all stay in this country!!! REGULATE THEM!!!! Take them over and let the government RUN THEM!!!!

And don't get me started about Apple. The government needs to break them up and take them over... I know my iPhone (which I can't live without) is so expensive because they ship them all over the world!!! IMAGINE!!! Those thousands of software and hardware engineers in Cupertino can go get jobs rebuilding bridges and roads... that'll teach em.
 
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Then all of our new computers would be like a Lenovo? Government run tech company.....prices just tripled and quality cut in half!
 
The first thing we need to do is get the Fed out of the Banking Industry. That 0% Interest they offer Banks is my tax dollars. They should be paying me 5% Interest to borrow money! Next they need taken out of the Energy Business. They have no business being in business to begin with!.....Health or Insurance also. I'm done ranting....thanks, Mike.
 
Stopped for gas this morning paid $3.18 per gallon,came back this afternoon and price was $3.49 per gallon.crazy.
 
comsnark said:
The banks own the government. How can the government get out of banking?
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So true..... flag_dollarsigns-150x150.jpg
 
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