Fuel Leak on my 280 (and bad mechanics)

[NautyDog]

This is my experience with a fuel leak on my 280 and how bad Marine Max has screwed it up. I hope all can learn from this.

I bought my 280 a year ago (from Jacksonville Marine Max) with 110 hours. Before the purchase, they agreed to fill the tank and do a 100 hour service on it. When my Surveyor showed up before the sale, he found several gallons of fuel in the bilge.

The Jacksonville Marine Max quickly had a Certified Service Tech on board and said it was due to a loose hose clamp on the fuel filter when it was changed for the 100 hour service. They "fixed" it.

That was the only issue with the boat, and I bought the boat & a 3 year warranty. After the sale, I had it transported it to its new home in Perdido Key, FL.

All was fine until after the next fill-up, then more fuel in the bilge. FYI.. the fuel did not appear while the boat was running (I checked constantly and took a number of other precautions). It was after the boat sat, i would come back and find GALLONS of fuel in the bilge - we aren't talking a few drops of fuel here.

Fortunately, no explosions... yet.

The mechanics from Marine Max in Pensacola showed up and said they fixed it - it was a loose hose clamp on the fuel tank. However, when I went back to the boat, I found more fuel. We did this one more time, before I got down in the engine room, and quickly discovered that there was no leaky hose clamp (there was NEVER any fuel residue anywhere except in the forward bilge). The leak was not coming from the engine room, but forward of the bulk head in the engine room. The only connection this far forward was the fuel sender (it's under the mid-berth). So I called Marine Max and told them to check this. I also asked that they check the bilge pumps since they had been exposed to so much fuel. The fuel sender is mounted on top of the tank, and the seal was leaking when the tank was near full. They FINALLY fixed the fuel sender seal and said the pumps were fine.

Turns out that all 3 bilge pumps were ruined and had dissolved from the fuel leak. I had to replace the two pumps and a float switch myself in addition to the $700 I spent on the MM service to "fix" this. Also, I had to replace the sump bilge. None of this was covered on the warranty. Further, the Jacksonville Marine M ax won't release the service records from the service they did since I did not actually own the boat while it was serviced.

Did I mention that I feel lucky to be alive?

I tried to keep the story brief, so there's more shocking details that what I explained here, and I'm not as dumb as I make myself sound. However, I want to share my experience with "certified" Marine Max mechanics. In addition to this, I had other (less fatal) problems that were never fixed, and yet I was charged for MarineMax to investigate.

Now, I'm back to doing all my own maintenance, and I will try to learn as much as I can from manuals, this forum and any other source of credible information.

There are tons of amazing mechanics out there, but how can I trust I will get a good one? These two problems (fuel leak and inoperable bilge pumps) are probably the two most serious problems one can have on a boat, and yet 4 visits from 2 different MareineMax locations actually made the problem worse

 

[skolbe]

Your own maintenance will be much more rewarding. While MM has some skilled mechanics - the service organization is run very poorly. The techs all mean well - but the service is not so hot. The service at my local dealership deteriorated rapidly after MM acquired them.

I like the dark green canvas on your 280.

 

[NautyDog]

I forgot to mention one more very important thing....

I talked to ex Sea Ray employee about this fuel leak and he told me about this not so uncommon problem....

There's a gap under the fuel tank in the bilge. But sometimes, screws or other items fall in the bilge and get under the fuel tank when it's near empty, then after a fill-up, the tank expands and the weight of 700 pounds of fuel will cause the tank to sit lower in the bilge.

If there's a screw under the tank, it can puncture the tank when it is full and cause a fuel leak. Sometimes, these screws come from the factory. Other times, it comes from owners. If this happens, it is amazingly expensive to replace the fuel tank, and if the problem isn't from the factory, it won't be covered under warranty.

Be careful!

 

[msd58]

Thank God you and your family are OK

 

[jitts3]

This is why I do my own work. The only thing I will shy away from is my Peterbilt. Just too many large items. Some I do but most I will not. Plus I need her back in a hurry. However I use the same shop for the majorty of the work and Carerpillar ONLY for the engine. I can keep track of them. Also I've spent small fortunes at both and can get my way on the rare repeat repairs.

 

[Tail Chaser 661]

Mechanics suck.
Buy a good service manual and do the work yourself.

If something would need a rebuild.
Save the grief and buy new.

 

[fwebster]

But there are going to be times when you need a good dealer and well trained competent technicians. Nautidog is close to a very good independant, non-Marine Max Sea Ray dealer. Treasure Island Marina owns stores in Destin and Panama City. I can't speak for the people who work in the Destin store, but I do know the Panama City mechanics and you won't find better, more competent technicians anywhere. Additionally, this is a family owned business and management of both stores is top notch.

I do a lot of my own maintenance, but 2-3 times a year, there is something I can't do, don't have time to do or don't want to do on my boat. Never once in 20+ years have I ever had to call the service manager back and say, "You forgot.... X, "You didn't get it fixed the first time", or "You left my boat in a mess".

 

[jitts3]

Truth be told I've considered buying and rebuilding some old drives and engines for extra cash. I've found engines to be simple to rebuild to me. Drives can't be that much harder with proper tools and parts. I have a few spare, "Junk" drives and the one I will use. A supposidly rebuilt one, but I have one as I have an plan to rebuild it to get ready for the eventual failure of the one I'll be running. Just an Idea.

 

[Tail Chaser 661]

True,
Sometimes you may not have the tools needed for a job.
Or just don't want to work on it.

My boat came with bad outdrive seals.
I pulled the drive, Took it to a Certified Merc Mechanic.
He pointed out I had some pitting on a upper drive gear.
(it did)
I told him to replace the gear or whatever it needs.
A single engine offshore boat must be reliable.

50 hrs later, Broke a tooth on the drive :smt013

These are the results I get when I let someone else touch my stuff every ten yrs or so.

When replacing big ticket items like engines and drives that should last 10 yrs or more.
I would rather buy new and be done with it.

Theres not that much price diff between a new long block and rebuilt either.
If a new engine died before its time.

 

[mawyatt]

Guess I am thankfull to have the MM dealer right next to the MM headquarters (next building over). The Clearwater MM seems to have a good service dept., at least from my experience so far. They just had my service advisor (Trent) leave for another career opportunity......so will see how the service goes from here.....and I have a port side leak that we can't find the source. I am hoping the new service folks will be as capable as Trent.

 

[mawyatt]

This is my experience with a fuel leak on my 280 and how bad MMax has screwed it up. I hope all can learn from this.

I bought my 280 a year ago (from Jacksonville MM) with 110 hours. Before the purchase, they agreed to fill the tank and do a 100 hour service on it. When my Surveyor showed up before the sale, he found several gallons of fuel in the bilge.

The Jacksonville MM quickly had a Certified Service Tech on board and said it was due to a loose hose clamp on the fuel filter when it was changed for the 100 hour service. They "fixed" it.

That was the only issue with the boat, and I bought the boat & a 3 year warranty. After the sale, I had it transported it to its new home in Perdido Key, FL.

All was fine until after the next fill-up, then more fuel in the bilge. FYI.. the fuel did not appear while the boat was running (I checked constantly and took a number of other precautions). It was after the boat sat, i would come back and find GALLONS of fuel in the bilge - we aren't talking a few drops of fuel here.

Fortunately, no explosions... yet.

The mechanics from MMax in Pensacola showed up and said they fixed it - it was a loose hose clamp on the fuel tank. However, when I went back to the boat, I found more fuel. We did this one more time, before I got down in the engine room, and quickly discovered that there was no leaky hose clamp (there was NEVER any fuel residue anywhere except in the center bilge). The leak was not coming from the engine room, but forward of the bulk head. The only connection this far forward was the fuel sender (it's under the mid-berth). So I called MM and told them to check this. I also asked that they check the bilge pumps since they had been exposed to so much fuel. The fuel sender is mounted on top of the tank, and the seal was leaking when the tank was near full. They FINALLY fixed the fuel sender seal and said the pumps were fine.

Turns out the pumps were goo and had dissolved from the fuel leak. I had to replace the two pumps and a float switch myself in addition to the $700 I spent on the MM service to "fix" this. None of this was covered on the warranty. Further, the Jacksonville MM won't release the service records from the service they did since I did not actually own the boat while it was serviced.

Did I mention that I feel lucky to be alive?

I tried to keep the story brief, so there's more shocking details that what I explained here, and I'm not as dumb as I make myself sound. However, I want to share my experience with "certified" MM mechanics. In addition to this, I had other (less fatal) problems that were never fixed, and yet I was charged for MM to investigate.

Now, I'm back to doing all my own maintenance, and I will try to learn as much as I can from manuals, this forum and any other source of credible information.

There are tons of amazing mechanics out there, but how can I trust I will get a good one? These two problems (fuel leak and inoperable bilge pumps) are probably the two most serious problems one can have on a boat, and yet 4 visits from 2 different MM locations actually made the problem worse

That is really scary!! Gald you found the source of the leak. Could this leak be the same as when you first took delivery? If so seems the Jacksonville MM missed the diagonsis, as did Pensacola, and you took delivery of a boat with a serious life threating fuel leak!! IMO this is not acceptable from both MMs and Jacksonville MM should be held accountable.

 

[NautyDog]

That is really scary!! Gald you found the source of the leak. Could this leak be the same as when you first took delivery? If so seems the Jacksonville MM missed the diagnosis, as did Pensacola, and you took delivery of a boat with a serious life threating fuel leak!! IMO this is not acceptable from both MMs and Jacksonville MM should be held accountable.

You are correct - Jacksonville Marine Max sold me a boat with a life threatening problem. And Pensacola Marine Max sent me back out 3 times. Further, I'm guessing that the Jacksonville Marine Max might have initiated the problem because they had filled the tank up to the neck.

I'm sorry to keep going on about this, but I really do feel lucky to not have had an issue. I was one spark away from an explosion (thank God for marine electrical safety standards).

If you read the threads on the boats that do explode from time to time, you hear lots of posts like "better run your blower", but my advice is to make sure you have a great mechanic.