Cummins Gauges

Jul 7, 2019
39
Boat Info
2005 Sea Ray aft cabin. 40’
Engines
425 hp. Cummings Diesil
I have a 2005 Sea Ray motor yacht.
The analog gauges are frozen! Even when shut off the batteries, they don’t move.
The engines are Cummins diesels and digital display works fine.
Any thoughts before I call an electrician?
Thanks!
Ted Christensen
 

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I have a 2005 Sea Ray motor yacht.
The analog gauges are frozen! Even when shut off the batteries, they don’t move.
The engines are Cummins diesels and digital display works fine.
Any thoughts before I call an electrician?
Thanks!
Ted Christensen
I'm Thinking if they are all frozen it might be a bad ground
 
I have a 2005 Sea Ray motor yacht.
The analog gauges are frozen! Even when shut off the batteries, they don’t move.
The engines are Cummins diesels and digital display works fine.
Any thoughts before I call an electrician?
Thanks!
Ted Christensen
Ted, I'm pretty sure your "analog" gauges are actually Smartcraft components and are fed through your digital display. There should be Smartcraft junction boxes behind your instrument panels with a wiring harness leading to your display. Branching off that harness should be leads to each set of gauges. First step I would take would be to check the connections at the junction box and the gauges. What version of digital (Smartcraft) display do you have? Depending on that there may be some troubleshooting possible from the display. Are your C-panel (RPM, Cruise Control, etc) switches working? They are connected via the same harness.
 
yes, I would disconnect all the plugs from the hubs and the vessel view unit. Then plug it all back in. They get their feed right off the vessel view harness. Very strange, never seen that befroe that they are all frozen. Thats why i would disconnect everything and then reconnect. Keep us posted.
 
He probably has a Diesel View and alluded that it still works. The Diesel View is the driver for the LinkSys gauges. It's unusual that all gauges are dead; they are fed data from the Diesel View from two different connections (port and starboard). At this point I would completely disconnect the Diesel View from the J-boxes and then reconnect - maybe the gauges will recover.
 
Here is the digital engine status box.
 

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He probably has a Diesel View and alluded that it still works. The Diesel View is the driver for the LinkSys gauges. It's unusual that all gauges are dead; they are fed data from the Diesel View from two different connections (port and starboard). At this point I would completely disconnect the Diesel View from the J-boxes and then reconnect - maybe the gauges will recover.
That’s what I am thinking the circuit for the gauge drivers just locked up
 
On the newer VesselView units, the gauges can be configured in the interface and the status checked; I once had to re-configure mine. I don't know if that's true in DieselView. Smartcraft refers to the gauges as "EasyLink"; I would look for reference to that in the interface if resetting the connectors doesn't work.
 
Problem solved!!! The wire harness was loose coming out of the smart craft display!
THANKS TO ALL OF YOU!
If your ever in the Seattle area I’ll buy you a beverage of your choice. You saved me the 130.00 that a marine electrician would have cost! This site has been invaluable.
 
There you go... Thanks for following up.
 
ocgrant nice boat and setup who did you use to config and install

also, have you had problems with the VV and gauges like so many if us with 2005-2009 cummins VV systems

thx
 
ocgrant nice boat and setup who did you use to config and install

also, have you had problems with the VV and gauges like so many if us with 2005-2009 cummins VV systems

thx
That would be me and help from this board. No my gauges have had no issues.
 
my installation guy is struggling to finish my axiom install, I have 3 MFD's (12" 9" 7") and we are not getting all the info that diesel view provided. Fuel burn, analog gauges not working, generator info and etc. told him i thought the diesel view needed to stay in the loop.
he assured me thats not the case. I said fine, what it takes its all gotta work for me to . I even offered up to buy a VV7 or 9 for that matter. We have installed all that with a new open array and forward looking FLIR along with a camera on the aft deck . if he gets it wrapped up in the next week I will be amazed.
 
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my installation guy is struggling to finish my axiom install, I have 3 MFD's (12" 9" 7") and we are not getting all the info that diesel view provided. Fuel burn, analog gauges not working, generator info and etc. told him i thought the diesel view needed to stay in the loop.
he assured me thats not the case. I said fine, what it takes its all gotta work for me to pay you. I even offered up to buy a VV7 or 9 for that matter. We have installed all that with a new open array and forward looking FLIR along with a camera on the aft deck . if he gets it wrapped up in the next week I will be amazed.
Well…First you will need the vessel view left in the boat to make the analog gauges work. Their feed comes from the vessel view system, so removing it will kill them.
Next I am not sure what he is using to get the feed to the Axioms? There are a couple options to feed the vessel view data to the N2K network you will have to build and connect to you RayNet network.
 
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Diesel View - This is the first generation of Mercury's multi-function display specific for engines, boat systems, and navigation. Your boat came with a Diesel View. Mercury's Smartcraft analog gauges for your boat are operated through a data link that originates from the Diesel View MFD. The gauges are called "System Link". You must have the Diesel View or Vessel View and appropriate wire harnesses to use these types of gauges. The Mercury Diesel View is the ONLY device that integrates with the Smartcraft CAN V which is the data network that the boat's generator transmits data on; the Vessel View MFD's do not work with the Smartcraft CAN V; Mercury discontinued supporting CAN V after Diesel View.

Vessel View - The Vessel View MFD's replaced the Diesel View. The Vessel View devices will operate the System Link gauges. Again, Mercury dropped the CAN V data network integration with the Vessel View product line consequently we loose the generator's data. The Vessel View product line does however integrate with NMEA 2000 data protocol and consequently can provide data to all aftermarket devices that are NMEA 2000 capable like the Raymarine Axiom, Garmin, Simrad, Furuno and other chartplotters. NOTE - Diesel View does not have a NMEA 2000 capability.

So, you have really two paths to get the data to the new Chartplotters and still have your gauges operate -
  • Keep the Diesel View and add add a Vessel View Link with the appropriate wiring harnesses from Mercury then install a Raymarine Seatalk NG network and/or a NMEA 2000 network with Seatalk NG adapter. You will loose the generator's data as the Vessel View Link does not integrate the generator's CAN V network.
  • Replace the Diesel View with the newer Vessel View display and install the Raymarine Seatalk NG or NMEA 2000 network. Again you will loose the generator's data.
Generator Data - Anyway you go about getting the data on a NMEA 2000/Seatalk NG data network you will loose the generator's data that is/was displayed on the Diesel View. Additionally, you will not be able to view the generator's data on any Vessel View product. Unless, you first convert the generator's data to NMEA 2000 data and provide that data on the NMEA 2000 network. Several of us on this forum have successfully converted the generator's data system to NMEA 2000; it is well documented on the forum and can be found through searches from my user name or @SKybolt , @alnav , @ocgrant , and others.

Fuel Burn Data - I'm not sure how or if the fuel data can be displayed on a device other than the Diesel View / Vessel View devices. I cannot get it to display on my Garmin 8000 series MFD's or on my Maretron displays. Essentially, the fuel burn calculations are an integration function provided by the Diesel View / Vessel View units in that data is provided from the Cummins ECM's for fuel flow rates and integrated with GPS speed/rate data provided on the Smartcraft / NMEA 2000 network(s). So, unless your Axiom MFD can support the execution of the fuel flow calculations then that data will not display.
 
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Fuel Burn Data - I'm not sure how or if the fuel data can be displayed on a device other than the Diesel View / Vessel View devices. I cannot get it to display on my Garmin 8000 series MFD's or on my Maretron displays. Essentially, the fuel burn calculations are an integration function provided by the Diesel View / Vessel View units in that data is provided from the Cummins ECM's for fuel flow rates and integrated with GPS speed/rate data provided on the Smartcraft / NMEA 2000 network(s). So, unless your Axiom MFD can support the execution of the fuel flow calculations then that data will not display.
Tom, I don't seem to have any problem getting fuel flow from QSB 425's via VV4/N2K. Burn rates and fuel remaining are a couple of the key data fields I have on my Garmin cruising screens. I find it easier to do fuel management on the Garmins that I ever remember on Smartcraft. Or, am I missing something with respect to fuel data?
 
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Tom, I don't seem to have any problem getting fuel flow from QSB 425's via VV4/N2K. Burn rates and fuel remaining are a couple of the key data fields I have on my Garmin cruising screens. I find it easier to do fuel management on the Garmins that I ever remember on Smartcraft. Or, am I missing something with respect to fuel data?
Hey Al - I've not yet been able to get the fuel data from the QSM11's other than fuel remaining which are the tank levels. Have you been able to integrate for MPG?
 
Hey Al - I've not yet been able to get the fuel data from the QSM11's other than fuel remaining which are the tank levels. Have you been able to integrate for MPG?
Tom, yes, I get MPG. I believer the Garmin is calculating it from a fuel flow rate coming from the VV via N2K. I don't remember having to do anything special to set it up but will review. I can capture the PGNs and take some screen shots next time I am at the boat.
 
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Tom, yes, I get MPG. I believer the Garmin is calculating it from a fuel flow rate coming from the VV via N2K. I don't remember having to do anything special to set it up but will review. I can capture the PGNs and take some screen shots next time I am at the boat.
Tom, I found a couple of older CAN log files produced by my N2K wifi converter. Here's a snapshot of engine status during a trip:
upload_2021-10-25_11-50-47.png

The N2K for Fuel Rate is 127489, Engine Parameters, Dynamic; this PGN transmits several other parameters like pressures and temps. If you haven't tried already, I would see if I could select Fuel Rate as the parameter for one of the existing data boxes.
The way Garmin handles fuel data can be confusing. I believe the only external parameter Garmin uses for fuel economy is Fuel Rate by using its own speed data. Also, I don't think Garmin uses fuel levels (except for display) but keeps its own record of total fuel onboard and this needs to be updated by the user. For example, I have gauges for fuel levels for each tank but also one for the amount of fuel the Garmin calculates is onboard.
Assuming your VV is transmitting Fuel Rate, I'm wondering if you need to set your fuel capacity and level to get fuel economy to work. From a fuel gauge page, press Menu and there are a couple of methods to set fuel levels.
 
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To @alnav Al's point, Garmin does not use the trip PGN 127496/7 for fuel info, only PGN 127489 for fuel flow and 127505 for fuel level, only for display. Not quite sure what Garmin is/was thinking not supporting fuel management but they don't really do that even though they have a screen just for that. They could have at least looked at 127505 for fuel level and remaining calculations. This is one of the only bad things I can say about the newer MFD's.

Here is a reference for the PGN's
https://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/PGN.html
https://www.nmea.org/Assets/20151026 nmea 2000 pgn_website_description_list.pdf

127496 Vessel Trip Fuel Consumption
127497 Engine Trip Fuel Consumption
127505 Fluid Level (pg 122 of Garmin manual)

Garmin PGN list Pg 183
https://www8.garmin.com/manuals/webhelp/gpsmap8400-8600/EN-US/GPSMAP_84xx-86xx-87xx_OM_EN-US.pdf
 
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