Considering a Sundancer 340....

[Knot It]

I do not have the link any more and for some reason, I dont show the PMs I sent to other members that asked for them. Perhaps they, XplicitInck, GrandMaster might still have the documents.

 

[Knot It]

Oh, and yes from what I see, it appears you have the riser and the resonator installed.

 

[Chris-380]

We recently purchased our '01 340 DA and could not be happier with the purchase...We LOVE it and have spent just about every weekend on her until last weekend when we winterized her:smt089.

As for the plastic through hulls and water intrusion, I have not heard of this being an issue, and have not seen any sign of it on our boat. Our gel coat is holding up very well and she looks like new after a bath. I must admit, I do need to give her a nice new wax job but she does shine and looks pretty. I have a few friends that have Rinkers, Chaps, Larsons, and Cruisers Yachts and I think mine (gel coat) looks as good or better than any of them.

Now on to the 7.4 Horizon and the dreaded water ingestion issue. I did EXTENSIVE research on this issue when we bought our 340. Our boat has the 7.4 Horizon and she had only 160 and 161 hours on the engines when we bought her so I was pretty concerned. In my research, I found that this issue occurred primarily in boats that are:

1.)1998-2001 model boats that operated in the salt water environment. It rarely, if ever, occurred in freshwater.

2.) Were the HORIZON models with V-drives. It was not only the 7.4 engines, it was reported to have occurred in the small block power packages as well.

3) Had the horizontal log style collector exhaust set up. In the salt water applications, the horizon's valve overlap (which was already purposefully extended to produce more power) was extended even further due to salt water corrossion slowing or not allowing the valves to seat properly thus creating an extended opportunity for the "reversion" to occurr which sometimes lead to catastrophic engine failure.

Sea Ray and Merc got together and a number of the engines that fell victim to this were replaced at no cost to the owners, some however were not so lucky. During my research, I was able to obtain Sea Rays internal SERVICE BULLETIN #02-07, dated 10/11/01. This bulletin explains the findings of the Sea Ray/Merc investigation of the "water ingestion" issue and the procedures for converting boats to the new water lift muffler. In the document, there was a procedure for owners of the '99-'01 model boats to get replacement of their damaged engines and or to have the conversion done. It also explains some safeguards and or preventative measures for those owners who were not having any problems. In cases where the log style mufflers were to remain the document lists/ explains the specific exhaust riser heights, tube length and down angles required by these engines for proper operation. I also found Mercruisers SERVICE BULLETIN #2001-13 which deals with the water ingestion issue from Merc's standpoint. I tried to upload the docs here but the system would not let me. I'll be glad to email these documents as well as another document about this issue to you if you would like.

So, in my shopping for a 340, I wanted the 7.4 Horizon for a number of reasons but primarily for the reliability and power they have as well as for the closed cooling. I worked with my dealer as well as my surveyor very closely in regards to the water ingestion issue to ensure I would be ok. So, as suggested in the Sea Ray and Merc service bulletins, here are the things I asked them to confirm in addition to the "regular survey" items.

1.) Exhaust tube length and down angle met or exceeded recommendations.
2.) Riser height extention had been completed and there were no signs of leaks in the riser joints.
3.) Hose clamp was installed in center of exhaust tubeing.
4.) Boat was infact a freshwater only boat. (had to speak to previous owners).
5.) Engines were original and had not been replaced.

Since our purchase, I have put almost 100 hours on her. We drove her home from just outside of Chicago down the Illinois river and boat on the Mississippi river and have not had any problems thus far. I also have a very good friend in my marina who owns a 1998 370 with the same engines and set up I have. He has 680 hours (all freshwater) on his engines and has had no problems either. Hope this helps.


Sam

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Hey Knot It! I live on the Illinois side, have a friend or 2 at the marinas up in alton/grafton on the Mississippi.

Would you please send me the literature you mention here. My survey is scheduled for monday at 9:00am

stlouisramsfan@hotmail.com

Thank You!
chris

 

[Knot It]

Here are the documents I could find.

 

[Chris-380]

Here are the documents I could find.

Thank you knot it!
it has been a real concern of mine. At LOTO, the mechanics and sea ray guys seem oblivious to this issue, so the salt water issue makes sense.....
fingers crossed. The boat i am working to buy has 733 hours, I am happy that i ma looking at a 380, the engine room looks tiny on the 340

 

[Knot It]

Is your boat on the river or LOTO now? If so what is the name on it? I might know the boat/owner. Where are you going to keep your boat? I'd say with 700+ hours, you are going to be fine. The first thing id be looking at is the numbers on the compression test. All cylinders should be within 10% of each other. If not start asking lots of questions. Yes the 340 ER is tiny and tough to work in and is the primary reason I love a 380.

Good luck,
Sammy

 

[sbw1]

Thanks. Yeah I realize this post is old, I was just hoping that Knot It would still be able to email the docs mentioned above. Thanks for the note on the coolant. It was investigated and not engine related.

In a nut shell, what people are saying, is the 7.4L engine is a proven performer. The issue was with the type of muffler used (called a log style if memory serves). Water was able to be drawn up into the engine because the exhaust design was not very good. Boats with 7.4L engines and water lift mufflers never had the ingestion issue.
As far as plastic through hulls are concerned and rot in the hull. The two are unrelated. In a cored hull, the rot can develop when a hole is drilled for a piece of hardware or a through hull. The exposed wood can absorb water and rot over time if if the edges are not properly sealed. This has nothing to do with what the fitting is made of.
The best way to seal the fitting holes is to trim them back a bit and build up a layer of epoxy at the edge so water can not infiltrate the wood. This is followed by a good sealant such as 3M 4200. This is also a good PM practice to protect an older boat. Here are a couple of pix of my boat getting a PM refit to prevent future problems after the boat was about 15 years old.

 

[Chris-380]

Is your boat on the river or LOTO now? If so what is the name on it? I might know the boat/owner. Where are you going to keep your boat? I'd say with 700+ hours, you are going to be fine. The first thing id be looking at is the numbers on the compression test. All cylinders should be within 10% of each other. If not start asking lots of questions. Yes the 340 ER is tiny and tough to work in and is the primary reason I love a 380.

Good luck,
Sammy

Hey Sammy
The boat is at MarineMax at LOTO. Named “Knot Golfin”. Besides the survey, I am getting a compression test done on the genny and both motors. So excited, hoping/prayers for everything to check out good

 

[CliffA]

Hey Sammy
The boat is at MarineMax at LOTO. Named “Knot Golfin”. Besides the survey, I am getting a compression test done on the genny and both motors. So excited, hoping/prayers for everything to check out good

do yourself a favor and include an inspection of the valves with the engine survey....the mechanic can use a borescope camera through a spark plug hole to see the valves....if there are any signs of rust there is a good chance the engines have suffered from water ingestion probably caused by the log style exhaust system....this is especially important if the engines are the 'high performance' versions since the valve timing on these engines actually caused a small 'suction' in the exhaust that made things even worse.....

good luck...
cliff

 

[Knot It]

Chris 380, I hope maybe this can help you a little bit. The attached photos are of my engines and exhaust set up and was taken by the dealer at the time of my purchase. I had them agree to include the photos showing/confirming the measurements and down angles were in compliance with Sea Ray bulletin 02-07 and was included as part of our Survey and closing documents.

 

[Chris-380]

Great info,
The one I am looking at, does have the riser, so I have that going for me!

Thank you

 

[boatman37]

What is the significance of the riser extension shown in the picture? My new boat has those

 

[Chris-380]

Makes the condensation drain out easier vs back toward the engine, also if water backs up in the exhaust, harder to make it all the way to the engine, at least that is the way I understand it

 

[Golfman25]

Great info,
The one I am looking at, does have the riser, so I have that going for me!

Thank you

In all likelihood the riser extension changed the angles for you.

This information has been a great help. Thanks to Knot it.

 

[midexp]

Chris 380, I hope maybe this can help you a little bit. The attached photos are of my engines and exhaust set up and was taken by the dealer at the time of my purchase. I had them agree to include the photos showing/confirming the measurements and down angles were in compliance with Sea Ray bulletin 02-07 and was included as part of our Survey and closing documents.View attachment 64804 View attachment 64805

Very detailed pictorial explanation - thanks. I have the same engines on my 400 Dancer. I guess one can assume the only way these exhaust tubes can not be to the proper pitch/angle is if they were changed after Sea Ray built the boat? Or do you know if SR is admitting they screwed up and owners should check all these angles? Or convert to this lift style exhaust? On a side note, I see your genny is buried like mine. It took me months to change the spark plugs. If the genny runs good and you haven't changed the plugs, I'd leave as is.

 

[Craig]

What ever possessed them to put the batteries back there I'll never know. I helped a friend change them once and what a bitch.