Can we really not do better then made in China?

Discussion in 'Holding Tank' started by Pyrojodge, Jul 28, 2013.

  1. islandhopper00

    islandhopper00 Active Member

    Jan 4, 2007
    Lake Norman (Denver) NC
    240 Sundancer
    5.0L 260hp, BIII outdrive
    You are good at redirection, I give you that. Must be a steward or a union lead. (I was a Teamster Steward at one time). I recognize the shift and blame tactic, I did it for 6 years, before I shifted to the dark side. haha
     
  2. Tritone

    Tritone New Member

    334
    Nov 28, 2012
    Lake St. Clair
    4600 SCB
    450 Cummins, Westerbeke generator

    Not trying to redirect anything. I'm just trying to get to the original topic. I am not sure how you can accuse me of using the "shift and blame tactic." I haven't blamed anyone for anything. Rather, several posters have blamed certain groups for ruining America. That's what the topic is. It keeps getting derailed.

    Actually I am not part of any union. Never have been.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2013
  3. Pseudomind

    Pseudomind Active Member

    Jul 1, 2008
    Jacksonville, FL
    2011 Hurricane with Magic Tilt Trailer
    115 HP Yamaha Four Stroke
    Well the concept of union's is basically good or it was at one time, but anymore, I do not side with tem or their tactics.

    1. It has been in the news a good bit recently about unions support this Illegal Alien rehash of immigration l was. I am curious as to why?

    2. I have worked around a number of Gov-Mint agencies and there are some employees who are quite good, but then there are many who are just sitting around carping and drawing a check. All of the Gov-mint worker, Postal, DMV, Veterans Affairs, (Should be renamed Veteran Non-Affairs), and the same for Social Security agency jokes came about for a reason, and it surely was not for their work ethic.

    There has ben a big push nation wide for the dummying down of the populace, (here in Florida the high school graduation requirement has been lower to a GPA of 2.0 on a 4.0 scale and the graduation rate is still just above 50 percent in may areas) and with their dummying down also goes with the "term "social media" so many see something flashed and then it is gospel. They can maybe spell 'duh" can sometimes add 2 plus 2 and arrive at the right answer then they are experts.

    You see tis quite often the killings in Chicago, New York , LA etc. The Traygone case, the number of murders and, th einept going ons of Stand your Ground, no challenges to Sharpton, Rangel, Holder, Jackson and others the medias lack of reporting, but they will report ad nausem about Beiber, Miley Cyrus. Lil Wayne and others. Todays media whether left or right are nothing more then propaganda machines same as the media's lack of reporting about some EPA decisions, the concept of the EPA is good, but not the implementation of some policies, as an example the big push which may close many coal fired plants there is basically nothing wrong with implementing procedures, but it has to be phased into a very downturned economy. Eliminating jobs all at once does no good, same as is going on with ObummerOnecare. Unless you are a turnip you should realize a good number of companies are going to part time jobs to avoid paying medical, but what is this doing to the economy?


    W have a broken economy, the middle class is being destroyed and all I ever hear about are the free loaders wanting even more. Well when the middle class is gone, then what?


    People just do not think any more, they just react

    Anyway bye, I am saying that those who have posted here are right or wrong

    But I will say this, some on here need to learn to read and quit playing the media game of bait and switch, or simply let's change the subject and not address the original issue(s)
     
  4. Tritone

    Tritone New Member

    334
    Nov 28, 2012
    Lake St. Clair
    4600 SCB
    450 Cummins, Westerbeke generator
    Now that's an interesting post, thank you. I am not sure we would agree on everything, but at least you gave your reasons. That's all I was asking for. Cheers.
     
  5. HUMPH

    HUMPH Well-Known Member PLATINUM Sponsor

    Nov 4, 2009
    SF BAY AREA
    2003 410DA,
    2004 C14 Caribe
    CAT 3126TA's 350HP/
    50HP Honda
    I like hats, well made hats. Don't really care who makes them. Isn't this what the thread started as?
     
  6. Zorba

    Zorba Active Member

    May 21, 2008
    East Harbor, Lake Erie
    2006 340 Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Mercruiser
    Exactly... BTW I like my hats made in Indonesia. THey must have big mannequin heads there because they always fit my big noggin well.

    Scott do some moderating and make this go away... to the holding tank at least.
     
  7. skibum

    skibum Well-Known Member

    Jul 30, 2007
    Perry Hall, MD
    2005 Sundancer 260
    496 Magnum HO
    So you are saying that the Indonesian hats are better than the Chinese hats? What about the South Korean hats? Give them a fair shake...
     
  8. Zorba

    Zorba Active Member

    May 21, 2008
    East Harbor, Lake Erie
    2006 340 Sundancer
    Twin 8.1 Mercruiser
    South Korean mannequins have smaller heads and affect their hat size...

    how's this for irony
    [​IMG]
     
  9. Gofirstclass

    Gofirstclass Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 20, 2010
    Tri Cities, WA
    1995 550 Sedan Bridge,
    2010 Boston Whaler 130 Super Sport,
    1981 Boston Whaler 130 Sport,
    CAT 3406C's, 580hp.
    Tritone, let me answer this portion of your earlier post from the viewpoint of someone who grew up in Michigan in the 50's and has watched what the auto industry has done to Detroit, to Michigan and to the economy of the country.

    Back in the day when the car plants had a shutdown in mid-summer for model year changeover, the unions would rotate around the "Big Three" as to which one they would go on strike against. The workers would pay into their strike fund throughout the term of the contract and get some or most of it back when the strike happened.

    Every year they would demand more and more wages and benefits and they usually got most of what they demanded in the strike settlement. It was a widely known fact that the auto workers were receiving more pay and benefits than a comparable worker in a non-union, private sector job. Each time they struck they received better health care, better pay, better retirement benefits, etc. Now, as I understand it, union employees and their families have free medical care for life. Please show me another industry (except maybe for Congress) that has that level of benefit.

    So, fast forward to the 70's and 80's and you have an entire industry that is bloated, over paid, over staffed and that is why it cost so much to buy an American badged car that basically was a piece of junk that wouldn't likely see 100,000 miles before it was dead alongside the road somewhere. Oh, and I forgot to mention that one of the benefits the unions got through all those strikes was that they could buy one of the cars their company produced at a price that generated little or no profit to the company.

    Somewhere along the line (I believe it was 1984) a setup was created (Google "Jobs Bank") where, if union employees were laid off, went on strike or were terminated they reported to the place where they received full pay and benefits while they were out of work. They would report there every morning and play cards, watch TV, read and sleep until their "shift" was done, then they would go home.

    Around that time (70's) foreign cars started coming ashore here in larger and larger numbers. People soon realized that the cars that were made overseas were less expensive, got better fuel economy, lasted longer, ran better and were quieter and more comfortable. As the sales numbers of foreign badged cars grew, the sales of the Big 3 declined.

    The Big 3 and the gubmint conspired to raise tariffs on the imported cars, thinking that would make the American junk more appealing. So the foreign car makers opened non-union plants in this country. They would make many of the parts overseas and ship them here for final assembly. They still were able to produce cars that cost less, lasted longer, got better mileage, etc.

    So fast further forward to what has happened to Detroit. It's a hotbed of corruption, graft and greed. Even the school district has failed because of the graft and corruption. Unemployment in and around Wayne County (Detroit & suburbs) is close to 50%. The city is in shambles, the city government is worse, and they just declared bankruptcy in hopes of resurrecting Detroit.

    You must live somewhere around the Detroit area so let me suggest you take a ride south on Jefferson Avenue from Grosse Pointe into Detroit. The change at Alter street is simply amazing. Then continue on Jefferson into the downtown area (if you dare) and see what Detroit looks like. Or a safer way to get the same view would be to go to Youtube and type in Detroit Ghetto. If you have not done that you will be amazed at the miles and miles of abandoned buildings, boarded up factories, neighborhoods where most of the homes have been left vacant, only to be burned to the ground on Devil's Night.

    These days, with the boom in car buying, Detroit's unemployment hovers just north of 10%. Michigan's unemployment is just south of 9%, while the US unemployment is around 7%.

    Detroit is bankrupt. The school district is on the verge of bankruptcy as are some of the suburban cities. Detroit has been a bastion of Democratic rule since its last Republican mayor in 1962. The entire city government is corrupt (Thanks in part to their last mayor Kwame Kilpatrick, who now is in prison) and it does not appear that situation is likely to change. There was a time in our country's history where unions were a necessary thing. They helped improve working conditions and pay, instituted child labor laws, etc.

    But look at where we are today. I recently read an article that said GM's cost of building a car includes almost $5,000 PER CAR in worker benefits and pay. No sane person would dispute the claim that the unions are corrupt. No sane person would dispute that the unions are a large part of what happened in Detroit. The operative word in those sentences though is "sane". Might I suggest you stop drinking the union Kool-Aid and open your eyes and ears. Stop looking at Fox News as "Faux News." I can't believe you would be so closed minded that you would not believe that the liberal media closes their eyes to what is happening in many areas around the country. There are two sides to every story. The liberal media most often chooses to gloss over important news or not report it at all. Is that what you really want--to be spoon fed your daily dose of propaganda without seeking out "the other side of the story."

    So Tritone, does this answer part of your question about how the unions destroyed part of our country?
     
  10. Gofirstclass

    Gofirstclass Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 20, 2010
    Tri Cities, WA
    1995 550 Sedan Bridge,
    2010 Boston Whaler 130 Super Sport,
    1981 Boston Whaler 130 Sport,
    CAT 3406C's, 580hp.
    Tritone, are you still around? I responded to your request, so what happened to you?
     
  11. OldSkool

    OldSkool Active Member

    May 8, 2010
    Boating on Raystown Lake, Pa
    restored 1976 SRV200
    188 Mercruiser I/O
    Tritone,
    It's not mud slinging when the statements are true and supported in fact. If you choose not to acknowledge fact then you can label the content what ever you like.

    I had my dues withheld, I know the contractor and the BA involved in the illegals statement (I will not give his name without permission). My wife was a teacher in Wisc and knows to well the challenges of removing a tenured teacher that is sub-standard.

    You may choose not to acknowledge the facts but that does not change them.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2013
  12. Gofirstclass

    Gofirstclass Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 20, 2010
    Tri Cities, WA
    1995 550 Sedan Bridge,
    2010 Boston Whaler 130 Super Sport,
    1981 Boston Whaler 130 Sport,
    CAT 3406C's, 580hp.
    I got a PM from Tritone. He said he is locked out from this thread. Go Figure.

    Scott? Can you shed any light on this?
     
  13. Gofirstclass

    Gofirstclass Well-Known Member GOLD Sponsor

    Apr 20, 2010
    Tri Cities, WA
    1995 550 Sedan Bridge,
    2010 Boston Whaler 130 Super Sport,
    1981 Boston Whaler 130 Sport,
    CAT 3406C's, 580hp.
    He PM'd me again and I gave him the password. Figure on seeing him post on there in the next day or so.
     
  14. MonacoMike

    MonacoMike Well-Known Member SILVER Sponsor

    Sep 15, 2009
    Indiana lakes and Lake Michigan
    2000 Cruisers 3870
    97 270 Sundancer
    85 Sea Ray Monaco 197
    8.2 Mercs,
    7.4 BII
    260hp Alpha 1
    My wife says I'm oblivious, well this proves it, I did not even notice the smell as we were put in the holding tank...

    Well told GFC...

    MM
     
  15. OldSkool

    OldSkool Active Member

    May 8, 2010
    Boating on Raystown Lake, Pa
    restored 1976 SRV200
    188 Mercruiser I/O
    I'm holding comment until Tritone can get back in. Seems only fair to let him have a chance to rebut.
     
  16. OldSkool

    OldSkool Active Member

    May 8, 2010
    Boating on Raystown Lake, Pa
    restored 1976 SRV200
    188 Mercruiser I/O
    We have been treading water here waiting for you and Gary to smell the blood in the water.LOL Just kidding, good to hear from you though.
     
  17. jason78

    jason78 Active Member TECHNICAL Contributor SILVER Sponsor

    Sep 3, 2008
    Fort Mill, SC / Lake Wylie
    1997 20 Outrage
    200 Merc Offshore
    Just caught back up with this thread. GFC- Great post about the Unions.
     

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