Brittnwy Griner

[Fill Ess]

 

[MrHappy]

I agree with your above statement, and for the first time in my long life, I do fear for the survivability of the American Experiment.

I believe leftism is destroying most of Western Society including America. It has infected everything... Education, Entertainment, Capitalism, Religion, Justice, Bureaucracies, etc.

Leftism has many problems, including being a proven failing ideology. But I believe the biggest concern is it tears at three very primary building blocks of Western Society that are the basis of thought and logic used by the founders of this country. They are:

Freedom
Justice
Truth

America was absolutely built on these. The left has simply stripped them away. Some obvious proof is freedom. The left craves ever more power to micromanage lives. And It throws out freedom of speech by saying it doesn't include hate speech, which is of course defined by them as anything they find objectionable. Freedom is being supplanted by obedience.

Justice has turned into "social" justice. Which does not mean justice. If it did, they would just say justice. What social justice means is revenge. Revenge for all previous real of perceived infractions going back for generations. And if you didn't commit the infractions, it's possible your ancestors did, and you will be a perfect stand in to accept punishment.

Truth has turned into "my" truth. This is not truth. If it were, they would just say truth. 'My truth' can be a total lie. It usually is. My truth just has to be something I think is true, or even simply would like to be true. Then you are required to treat 'my truth' as if it were actual truth. If you do not, you will be tarred and feathered as hateful and worse for your belief.

Golfman, I would politely differ about your fear of this getting a foothold in America. It rules the day. Almost all of American has already been taken over by it, even though about half of us find it repulsive, a big chunk are indifferent, and only a small minority embrace it.

Proof? It would be no problem for any of us to name hundreds of influential people (and institutions) in Education, Entertainment, Capitalism, Religion, Justice, Bureaucracies, etc. who are open, obvious, admitted, hardcore leftists proudly promoting their ideology in everything they do. We could use names we all know. Now, name me 10 individuals or institutions in those same categories that are openly speaking against leftism, and defending traditional American values in a robust way. And what befalls the very few that do try to counter leftism?

I would like to shake your hand.

 

[El Capitan]

Because as much as I dislike her, she was suffering an injustice. I know she broke the law, but the penalty given the offense was unjust, and I believe immoral. Would we cheer the long term, hard labor imprisonment of our favorite and most notable American over a petty local crime? If not, we should not favor her imprisonment either, no matter whether we like her. Justice should be blind. In this case, blind justice would favor her return home.

I believe America has a duty to protect it's citizens simply for being an American. I am not for rating their patriotism first.

I think the State Department got her back for the wrong reasons. I think they handled the situation poorly. I think they negotiated from a position of profound weakness (which amazes me... who is in the long protracted, unsuccessful war? And yet, we bow to Putin).

But yes, I am glad she is back. It hope it is a profoundly teachable moment about America for her and those who hold her political views.

You lost me at “immoral” “injustice” and “ unjust”.

I’m starting to suspect you’re a misinformed bleeding heart.

We, nor you or I can judge the laws of another country. She knowingly and willingly broke their laws. You opine the penalty as unjust and immoral. Based on what standards do you pass that judgement?

You lost me.

 

[Golfman25]

You lost me at “immoral” “injustice” and “ unjust”.

I’m starting to suspect you’re a misinformed bleeding heart.

We, nor you or I can judge the laws of another country. She knowingly and willingly broke their laws. You opine the penalty as unjust and immoral. Based on what standards do you pass that judgement?

You lost me.

Sure we can judge other country's laws. We can say "those guys are crazy." However, if we step foot on their soil, we do have to abide by their crazy chit.

 

[Halfhitch]

Sure we can judge other country's laws. We can say "those guys are crazy." However, if we step foot on their soil, we do have to abide by their crazy chit.

I agree. When you go onto your neighbors property and his German Shepherd explains the rules to you and meets out your penalty for breaking the rules that has been set forth, you have no right to think the neighbors rules are wrong, they are just different than what you like.

Now you have to remember Griner had crossed onto that neighbors property once before and that neighbor explained his rules but held onto his German Shepherd. Griner came back, thumbed his nose at the neighbors rules so the neighbor let things play out by his rules. Wake up Giner! You thumb your nose at the US and get away with it, other lands don't give you a pass.

Makes me sick to think about that trade that was made. Many people will die due to that madmans release.

 

[dwna1a]

Because as much as I dislike her, she was suffering an injustice. I know she broke the law, but the penalty given the offense was unjust, and I believe immoral. Would we cheer the long term, hard labor imprisonment of our favorite and most notable American over a petty local crime? If not, we should not favor her imprisonment either, no matter whether we like her. Justice should be blind. In this case, blind justice would favor her return home.

I believe America has a duty to protect it's citizens simply for being an American. I am not for rating their patriotism first.

I think the State Department got her back for the wrong reasons. I think they handled the situation poorly. I think they negotiated from a position of profound weakness (which amazes me... who is in the long protracted, unsuccessful war? And yet, we bow to Putin).

But yes, I am glad she is back. It hope it is a profoundly teachable moment about America for her and those who hold her political views.

Keo I disagree. She knew what she was doing was illegal as all hell in Russia it was her second offense. She took the risk and got caught. If it was any other country with strong smuggling laws, say Mexico she would be there still. I my mind all that she might have learn is I can do this and somebody will come save me.

She got caught smuggling now matter the amount, she got caught.
Second offense, she should be in their system. We have no right to say it was to hard for her, we need to run in and save her.

GFC hit the nail right on the head VOTEs She was the politician trifecta

 

[mrsrobinson]

And now she is claiming she will do everything possible to help the marine return home..uh huh.

"use her platform to fight to bring imprisoned ex-Marine Paul Whelan home from Russia. "

At least now when you Google "Brittney" she comes up first, and not Spears

Oh, and thank god she is going to play basketball again, and she is, clear, on that...

"I also want to make one thing very clear: I intend to play basketball for the WNBA’s Phoenix Mercury this season, and in doing so, I look forward to being able to say ‘thank you’ to those of you who advocated, wrote, and posted for me in person soon,"

 

[Skybolt]

I agree with your above statement, and for the first time in my long life, I do fear for the survivability of the American Experiment.

I believe leftism is destroying most of Western Society including America. It has infected everything... Education, Entertainment, Capitalism, Religion, Justice, Bureaucracies, etc.

Leftism has many problems, including being a proven failing ideology. But I believe the biggest concern is it tears at three very primary building blocks of Western Society that are the basis of thought and logic used by the founders of this country. They are:

Freedom
Justice
Truth

America was absolutely built on these. The left has simply stripped them away. Some obvious proof is freedom. The left craves ever more power to micromanage lives. And It throws out freedom of speech by saying it doesn't include hate speech, which is of course defined by them as anything they find objectionable. Freedom is being supplanted by obedience.

Justice has turned into "social" justice. Which does not mean justice. If it did, they would just say justice. What social justice means is revenge. Revenge for all previous real of perceived infractions going back for generations. And if you didn't commit the infractions, it's possible your ancestors did, and you will be a perfect stand in to accept punishment.

Truth has turned into "my" truth. This is not truth. If it were, they would just say truth. 'My truth' can be a total lie. It usually is. My truth just has to be something I think is true, or even simply would like to be true. Then you are required to treat 'my truth' as if it were actual truth. If you do not, you will be tarred and feathered as hateful and worse for your belief.

Golfman, I would politely differ about your fear of this getting a foothold in America. It rules the day. Almost all of American has already been taken over by it, even though about half of us find it repulsive, a big chunk are indifferent, and only a small minority embrace it.

Proof? It would be no problem for any of us to name hundreds of influential people (and institutions) in Education, Entertainment, Capitalism, Religion, Justice, Bureaucracies, etc. who are open, obvious, admitted, hardcore leftists proudly promoting their ideology in everything they do. We could use names we all know. Now, name me 10 individuals or institutions in those same categories that are openly speaking against leftism, and defending traditional American values in a robust way. And what befalls the very few that do try to counter leftism?

While I disagree on your other post about glad she is home. This statement is the epidemy of the exact truth on what's going on.

I also would like to shake your hand, well said.

 

[Wanderer 290]

I heard she took a knee during the playing of the Russian national anthem in prison and she was kicked out of the country….

 

[keokie]

You lost me at “immoral” “injustice” and “ unjust”.

I’m starting to suspect you’re a misinformed bleeding heart.

We, nor you or I can judge the laws of another country. She knowingly and willingly broke their laws. You opine the penalty as unjust and immoral. Based on what standards do you pass that judgement?

You lost me.

I respect your logic. If I lost you, let me see if I can find you with this:

We can and should judge the laws of other countries. Some of our finest moments are when we do. JFK "I am a Berliner". Reagan, "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall." The Nuremberg trials. Plenty of others. This is how the world gets changed for the better.

I believe justice is based on morality and I believe morality is constant. Our founders believed the same. That is what the statement about these truths being self-evident means. They said that all men deserved freedom (among other things). They placed no geographical or political restrictions on their statements.

While I believe morality to be a constant, I certainly do not claim to be the arbiter of all that is right and wrong. I am certain about a few things, I feel strongly about a bunch of others, eventually get to a bunch where I really just don't know. And I recognize I may be wrong on some moral issues including ones I feel certain about.

But there IS an objective right and wrong. I believe this country was founded with the ingredients to find what is right and defend it.

So, when an American citizen is facing unjust punishment in another country. I do believe we have a moral responsibility to get them back. And I would not have made that trade.

I believe we should always be a force for moral good in the world. No, I do not think that means we should be the world's cop. I do think the founding principles of this country should serve as the conscience of the world. If not our founding principles, then whose?

My fear is, the founding principles are taking an absolute beating right here in America where they have created the freest, safest, wealthiest, most advanced society with the highest standard of living known so far in human history.

I fear I have not done enough to defend the values that created this country, but my belief in the superiority of those values in terms of government and justice has not wavered in the least.

I respected the well-formed differing opinions in this thread. They have certainly helped me to question my reasoning and think much more deeply on the matter.

 

[ttmott]

I respect your logic. If I lost you, let me see if I can find you with this:

We can and should judge the laws of other countries. Some of our finest moments are when we do. JFK "I am a Berliner". Reagan, "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall." The Nuremberg trials. Plenty of others. This is how the world gets changed for the better.

I believe justice is based on morality and I believe morality is constant. Our founders believed the same. That is what the statement about these truths being self-evident means. They said that all men deserved freedom (among other things). They placed no geographical or political restrictions on their statements.

While I believe morality to be a constant, I certainly do not claim to be the arbiter of all that is right and wrong. I am certain about a few things, I feel strongly about a bunch of others, eventually get to a bunch where I really just don't know. And I recognize I may be wrong on some moral issues including ones I feel certain about.

But there IS an objective right and wrong. I believe this country was founded with the ingredients to find what is right and defend it.

So, when an American citizen is facing unjust punishment in another country. I do believe we have a moral responsibility to get them back. And I would not have made that trade.

I believe we should always be a force for moral good in the world. No, I do not think that means we should be the world's cop. I do think the founding principles of this country should serve as the conscience of the world. If not our founding principles, then whose?

My fear is, the founding principles are taking an absolute beating right here in America where they have created the freest, safest, wealthiest, most advanced society with the highest standard of living known so far in human history.

I fear I have not done enough to defend the values that created this country, but my belief in the superiority of those values in terms of government and justice has not wavered in the least.

I respected the well-formed differing opinions in this thread. They have certainly helped me to question my reasoning and think much more deeply on the matter.

Well articulated - one thing though, the moral good for one is not necessarily the moral good for many and can be conflicting concepts. Modern governmental representatives here in the US too often neglect the good for many.

 

[keokie]

Well articulated - one thing though, the moral good for one is not necessarily the moral good for many and can be conflicting decisions. Modern governmental representatives here in the US too often neglect the good for many.

That is an important distinction, and I agree. That's part of why I think the trade was ill-advised.

 

[JayhawkCurtis]

 

[dwna1a]

And now she is claiming she will do everything possible to help the marine return home..uh huh.

"use her platform to fight to bring imprisoned ex-Marine Paul Whelan home from Russia. "

At least now when you Google "Brittney" she comes up first, and not Spears

Oh, and thank god she is going to play basketball again, and she is, clear, on that...

"I also want to make one thing very clear: I intend to play basketball for the WNBA’s Phoenix Mercury this season, and in doing so, I look forward to being able to say ‘thank you’ to those of you who advocated, wrote, and posted for me in person soon,"

And I hope she is drug tested before each game and searched at every airport. I think any office at every level now has probably cause. Remember I’m no LEO, just a plain old nobody.

 

[dwna1a]

I respect your logic. If I lost you, let me see if I can find you with this:

We can and should judge the laws of other countries. Some of our finest moments are when we do. JFK "I am a Berliner". Reagan, "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall." The Nuremberg trials. Plenty of others. This is how the world gets changed for the better.

I believe justice is based on morality and I believe morality is constant. Our founders believed the same. That is what the statement about these truths being self-evident means. They said that all men deserved freedom (among other things). They placed no geographical or political restrictions on their statements.

While I believe morality to be a constant, I certainly do not claim to be the arbiter of all that is right and wrong. I am certain about a few things, I feel strongly about a bunch of others, eventually get to a bunch where I really just don't know. And I recognize I may be wrong on some moral issues including ones I feel certain about.

But there IS an objective right and wrong. I believe this country was founded with the ingredients to find what is right and defend it.

So, when an American citizen is facing unjust punishment in another country. I do believe we have a moral responsibility to get them back. And I would not have made that trade.

I believe we should always be a force for moral good in the world. No, I do not think that means we should be the world's cop. I do think the founding principles of this country should serve as the conscience of the world. If not our founding principles, then whose?

My fear is, the founding principles are taking an absolute beating right here in America where they have created the freest, safest, wealthiest, most advanced society with the highest standard of living known so far in human history.

I fear I have not done enough to defend the values that created this country, but my belief in the superiority of those values in terms of government and justice has not wavered in the least.

I respected the well-formed differing opinions in this thread. They have certainly helped me to question my reasoning and think much more deeply on the matter.

Thank you, this one statement should also be on the A.P Hill thread.
I didn’t fight for our country and I’m sorry for that., but I’ve lost. It does not give me any platform to stand on. Anyway, thank you. I did not know my brother very well, he past in the early 70’s. just after Christmas. He was a good Marine.