Bow stopper position / boat position on trailer (tongue weight)

Hai Nhi said:
The previous owner only had straps (2 front & 2 rear). The boat was off from the bow stopper about 1 foot or so. But when I tow, I don't like the feeling of the boat bouncing up & down. That's why I moved the tongue back as much as I can, then moved the boat up about 6". Now bow is resting on stopper. 4 straps are still in place.
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Hai Nhi, your boat position in your signature is totally incorrect at the minimum and downright dangerous to all concerned. If the boat will not fit the trailer, which I think it can, needs to be setup by someone who is a pro at this. Your boat must always be snug to the bow stop. Your strap setup is also not done to maximize safety and minimize damage and danger to the vessel. I have taken your picture and marked the best locations to place your straps. At the bow your bow eye should be snug to the bow stop and safety chain engaged. (Be sure you have a heavy rated winch strap, many are 2000 lbs.) Then a 10,000 lbs. ratchet strap running down from the bow eye to a frame rail will provide excellent pull down and back in heavy braking situations, holding the bow on the trailer. In your picture, it appears you are trying to hold down the bow with your cleats, they may not be built for road forces and all the extra strap out adds to the strap stretch and may allow the boat to move on the trailer. and finally you are more likely to damage the gelcoat, cleats, and rub rails with your method.

At the rear you appear have the straps positioned to keep the boat from sliding off the back. I put a loop of high grade chain and fastener around the rear most frame rail and run one 10,000 lbs. strap on each side. I put a small towel between any point the strap and gelcoat meet, but all points are below the in the water visual level. This setup has the benefit of actually holding the stern down on the rear of the trailer.

d80bbb56a17dd6c7131e3f4fd62dd2c5_zps35697634.jpg


For any trailer tie down one is setting up four questions must be answered, sadly, most folks just stick a strap here, there, and say "yep, that ought to do it".

What is keeping the trailer from sliding off the back?

The winch strap and safety chain.

What is keeping the boat from jumping on the truck in a panic braking situation?

The eye strap pulling back and down, while the winch strap keeps it locked to the bow stop, and the safety chain.

What is holding the stern down and keeping the rear from swinging around hitting the truck during a panic braking situation?

Two 10,000 lbs. straps down to the frame.

MM
 
You know I'm surprised I didn't see that but you are right. The way she is held down in the signature picture is very bad. She should be against the bow stop. If the weight is good where she sits, move the bow stop. You need enough straps hooked properly as MM said. Straps have on them a WLL (working load limit) the total of all straps should be greater than the weight of the boat and all her gear. Not only that but the attach points must be capable of handling the WLL of the straps.
Boat trailers like all trailers flex as you drive. Securing the load to the trailer makes the trailer more ridged. I am surprised how many times i see a boat on the road bouncing against the bow stop. I have seen a couple boats run over the bow stop and almost into the tow vehicle.
In trucking every state has a special division of their State Police to enforce truck laws. MOTOR CARRIER ENFORCEMENT. They will bust me fast if I have a improperly secured load on my flatbed. Yet we see people put a 6,000 boat on a trailer and a 500 lb strap, trailer lights if you are lucky going down the road on a trailer with no brakes and dry rot tires.
I'm not saying that the case here by any stretch. But we know they are out there.....
 
Your trailer is to long for your boat. The weight of the boat needs to be carried by the axles, not the beams of the trailer....like in your set up. The frame rails can fold up, and since yours is starting to bend you need to be careful. I'm surprised your not complaining about your surge brakes not working correctly, or your ball getting damaged. You need to have a professional check your set up to see if they can adjust it to fit your boat. I'll be surprised if they don't try to sell you a proper fitting trailer.
 
I know I'm late to the party, but I have some thoughts.

The boat should be farther back on the suspension. The Sea Ray hull emblem should be pretty close to directly over the center axle. That should put about 90% - 95%of the weight on the suspension.

The bow post needs to come back and contact the bow, and be tied down as others have said.

All that being said, you need to get the boat off the trailer. If the frame remains bent, that's all she wrote, it's done. The best way to check the frame is with a tight string stretched along the frame.

Henry


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You guys are saying your boat moves on your trailer when loaded?
I find if I don't get mine where it needs to be that's where it's gonna be untill I unload it. I have tried to move my boat forward by slamming on the brakes because I didn't get it tight to the bow roller. It doesn't move. I have had to go back to the ramp and float the boat to tighten it up.

The straps are to keep the trailer under the boat during an accident situation, my opinion.
 
It would be nice if he posted better pics of his rig....and a pic of whatever, wherever is bent. But guys he already did correct the fact the bow wasn't against the stop....
Hai Nhi said:
The previous owner only had straps (2 front & 2 rear). The boat was off from the bow stopper about 1 foot or so. But when I tow, I don't like the feeling of the boat bouncing up & down. That's why I moved the tongue back as much as I can, then moved the boat up about 6". Now bow is resting on stopper. 4 straps are still in place.
Click to expand...
 
islandhopper00 said:
You guys are saying your boat moves on your trailer when loaded?
I find if I don't get mine where it needs to be that's where it's gonna be untill I unload it. I have tried to move my boat forward by slamming on the brakes because I didn't get it tight to the bow roller. It doesn't move. I have had to go back to the ramp and float the boat to tighten it up.
Click to expand...

Agreed that if you want to move it on the trailer, it will be impossible. No the boat doesn't move in normal circumstances, it is all about prepping for abnormal circumstances. Most trips I make could be done with no straps, but don't stop in front of me, make me abruptly change lanes, or go around interstate ramps at speed.

islandhopper00 said:
The straps are to keep the trailer under the boat during an accident situation, my opinion.
Click to expand...

You say tomato I say tomato, what's the difference. A boat can launch off a trailer in hard braking but the straps both keep the trailer under as much as it keeps the boat on. The problem seems to me, to be when they separate... LOL

MM
 
Woody said:
It would be nice if he posted better pics of his rig....and a pic of whatever, wherever is bent. But guys he already did correct the fact the bow wasn't against the stop....
Click to expand...

Some things are as much for lurkers to read as the OP. I felt it was important to post that comment for the thread.

MM
 
Woody said:
It would be nice if he posted better pics of his rig....and a pic of whatever, wherever is bent. But guys he already did correct the fact the bow wasn't against the stop....
Click to expand...

You are correct. He did. But the tie downs may need adjusting. I would trust the bow eye more than the cleats. The other issue is his weight distribution by the boats position. He must weigh it to see where he stands. Until then we are kinda guessing.
 
Thanks everyone for the comments, all good ones even the ones I've already done and knew about. Chances for everyone to review.

I still haven't had a chance to fix my trailer jack yet so no weighing neither.

I noticed about the Trailer length, a bit too long. But I still want to find out for sure if 10-15% tongue weight is good, if not what's the right number.

I know some of us mentioned 5, some said 7%. But all I read from manuals and all said 10-15%. I supposed numbers from manuals probably backed by some research and what not.

With all due respect for everyone here. But if someone say "I've done it for years" or "a trailer shop guy said so", to me, I'm not sure that'd soothe me well enough to follow. Hehehe.

In another word, why shouldn't we follow 10-15% rule ? Just pondering!!!

I'll take some picture of what the current setup I have for now. Btw, I have 6 straps total. All 10,000 lbs rating. 4 in the back.




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Hai Nhi said:
Thanks everyone for the comments, all good ones even the ones I've already done and knew about. Chances for everyone to review.

I still haven't had a chance to fix my trailer jack yet so no weighing neither.

I noticed about the Trailer length, a bit too long. But I still want to find out for sure if 10-15% tongue weight is good, if not what's the right number.

I know some of us mentioned 5, some said 7%. But all I read from manuals and all said 10-15%. I supposed numbers from manuals probably backed by some research and what not.

With all due respect for everyone here. But if someone say "I've done it for years" or "a trailer shop guy said so", to me, I'm not sure that'd soothe me well enough to follow. Hehehe.

In another word, why shouldn't we follow 10-15% rule ? Just pondering!!!

I'll take some picture of what the current setup I have for now. Btw, I have 6 straps total. All 10,000 lbs rating. 4 in the back.




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Click to expand...

I'm going to bow out of this discussion. It seems you are less interested in getting helpful advice and more interested in validating the conclusions you have already made.
That being said, you have already posted that the trailer frame is bent. It got bent because there is too much weight being transferred to the towing vehicle. QED there is something wrong with the way the trailer is set up. As for your straps, you wouldn't need six of them if the trailer was set up properly.

I suggest you download a copy of the North American Cargo Securement Requirements. This is published jointly by the CDOT and US DOT, as well as various trucking associations. While it is meant for commercial trucking, the material goes into the proper (safe) way to secure cargo on a trailer.

Henry
 
+1 Henry, time to bow out... but for safety's sake I cannot resist pleading reconsideration for the obvious that has already been pointed out. The trailer rails are bent and weakened - the trailer is no longer safe; especially so with an overloaded tongue weight that has already bent it.

"But I still want to find out for sure if 10-15% tongue weight is good, if not what's the right number." The answer is already in post #10 of this thread.

"In another word, why shouldn't we follow 10-15% rule ? Just pondering!!!" Ummm... because it has bent and ruined your trailer, that's why. You even broke your jack trying to lift that weight. And listening to the advice of "some trailer shop guy" professional that has decades of experience and is legally liable for his work may be worth listening to more than someone who has adjusted the weight by the seat of their pants and bent the trailer.

My best wishes to you are for answers and safe trailering. Be safe and enjoy your boat.
 
Last edited:
+3.............

I'll add, You need to check liability concerns surrounding improper loading of "cargo". If you have a wreck and an investigation is conducted..........blah, blah, blah. You get my meaning.
It's what I always think about when I'm towing, specially when I'm rolling down the highway at 65+mph (I mostly tow around 60mph). How you gonna feel if you hurt someone. It's to late then.
 
Well first of all, pls don't take it personal. What I tried to find out is when someone offers certain information, how would I make sure it's valid enough to follow, especially it's involved safety issue such as this.

Before posting here,
1) I heard my previous owner who quoted his professional trucking company who towed this boat from Florida to CA: that leaving the boat off the from the bow stopper so it won't damage to boat bow. And using 4 straps is more then enough.
2) I also visited a trailer manufacturer (not just a reseller) who also has an in house technician. And they said 10-15%.
3) the manual (sea ray owner manual) also mentioned 10-15%, which also show in most of the searches I did from google (including sites like ehow, etrailer, etc)
4) some other sites even mentioned 5-7% (shoreline trailer for one)
5) posts here mentioned 7%

Now hopefully you all understand where I'm coming from receiving all these contradicting info. And that's when I turned to forum posters on forums like this, hoping to get some sense out of it.

I might not have expressed my thoughts well enough which in turn might offend people. My apology if I do, didn't mean it though. Thinking about what I posted, the fact that the trailer is bent for example. I think I didn't make it clear that the trailer was bought just right before he towed it back to ca. So it might be bent before because I think the trailer is stronger & more capable then what it's carrying now. In another word, I'm not sure if the wrong tongue weight is the cause or not. That's one of the reasons I'd like to find out for sure what would be the correct set up for it.

Thanks, and ... Let's breath in ... Breath out & cheer for your Olympic team. Our lives are hard enough I think. So please don't let small matters ruin the fun, especially the fun of helping (and enjoy boating life of course). :)





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Some unnecessary roughness in this thread....:smt043 Hai Nhi is not doing a good job asking questions but neither are you quys. Proper tongue weight?...well that depends and the answers illustrate that, except we don't have enough info to go any farther. Boats to heavy for the trailer?...maybe, but how do we know what it's rated for. WTF is this nonsense
islandhopper00 said:
Your trailer is to long for your boat.
Click to expand...
You guys got the whole trailer bent to hell due to excessive tongue weight but all he said is this
Hai Nhi said:
The front of the trailer is bent too. Not sure if it was bent before I bought it, or just recently. Should not be much of a problem though. View attachment 33963
Click to expand...
So like I wondered before...what's bent? For all we know the trailer was jack knifed and the tongue got bent...something that would need to be addressed but certainly nothing to do with improper loading. When I look at that one pic of his trailer the whole trailer frame looks strange but it might be the perspective.

Hai Nhi here's some questions,

-Could you please put up some pics of your trailer including whatever is bent
-Do you know what that trailer is rated for...maybe there is a tag on it.
-What are you towing it with, this will have bearing on tongue weight
-what is the hitch rating on your tow vehicle

Here's a better idea of his boat weight for starters, 280DA w/T-4.3, the tow vehicle was 7,500#
View attachment 34260
 
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