Anchor size

osd9

osd9

New Member
Oct 3, 2006
4,874
MidAtlantic
Boat Info
2003 410DA
Engines
Caterpillar 3126-TA w/ ZF 80-IV
I went to the AC Airshow yesterday and the winds were a blowin'....15-20 knots SSW. Along with about 500 other boats, I set my anchor about a 1/4 mile off shore.....18 feet of water....sandy bottom.

We were bouncing around in 3-5 footers with biggy evert now and then. The bow dipped a few times and an un-God-ly sound was heard as the bow tugged and pulled on the all chain rhode. After about an hour or so, the majority of the crew were turning green, so I had to pull anchor and head inshore.

When I pulled the anchor....the shank was bent like a pretzel... :smt101 .....I either found the only rock off the AC beach or I should get a metal for the best set anchor in sand....


I've already determined that it's not worth having this one fixed...it's destined to be lawn ornament...

What I'm asking is:

What type anchor would you recommend for 410DA?
What size anchor would you recommend for a 410DA?
What do you think of the anchors with a swivel shank?
Any comments on the Stainless Steel anchors?
Where is a good place to shop, ie: best price?

Thanks...Oh, I never did get to see the Thunderbirds.... :smt089 ,
 
Dominic,
I got rid of the Searay plow and bought a Fortress (I think a 23 but I could be wrong). Never had it fail. Can't same about the plow!! Just my $.02.

Matter of fact, I have the plow in the basement if you want it...
 
A couple of thoughts:

First, I have friends and family who love the CQR and would highly recommend it.

Next, get one a size bigger than is recommended for the boat. Although I think the one that came standard with the 410 was appropriate and only dragged on me once (in grass).

Third is when you are anchoring with chain, especially in heavy seas, you should use a nylon bridle to absorb some of the load on the chain.

Lastly, a trip line can save your anchor if it ever gets caught in rocks or other obstructions.
 
Thanks Jeff.....I'm still getting used to the all/mostly chain thing. I really like the nylon bridle in heavy seas idea....would you mind elaborating on how you set it up?

Also, I remember you posted once on SRO with regard to your trip line set up. Do have that info handy also?

The link above is for one size up. The 410DA came with a 33 LB'r. I'm planning on a 44 LB'r to replace it with.


Thanks again,
 
Dom, you are putting it too mildly... We were one of those 500 boats and it was probably the most awful time I've ever had on the water! I should have known better with the SSW winds, but the kids really wanted to see the show so we stuck it out until 3:30 and only a few boats were still there. It got much worse after 2:30 or so...

Could there be such a thing as violent 3-to-5's vs the good ol' regular 3-to-5s?

No bent anchor shaft for us, but it was strange seeing my bow-rail mounted light get dipped into the atlantic every 8 seconds! I expected the anchor rode to get sheared -- I wrote the anchor off immediately after I set it and figured that when I lost it, that would be the time to head back...

My wife and I were wondering how much better it would be in a 40+ sundancer in those conditions... :smt101 ..sounds like not good enough...
 
Dominic,

One of the beautiful aspects of your chain/line set up is that in deep water or in heavy weather you can let out 150' of chain and then have 200' of nylon to play with. If you use enough scope to get to the nylon, there is no need for the bridle I will describe below. 18' of water, plus the height of the bow - 4' means you should have been very close to the chain/rope splice.

My bridle is made from 5/8" 3-strand Nylon line. It is a Y-shape arrangement with the bottom of the "Y" toward the chain and the top forks of the Y at the boat end. On the boat end there are eye splices to go around my two bow cleats. The whole Y is about 15' from end to end, but could be longer or short to suit your needs. There is a thimble spliced in to the outboard end. Through that thimble is a shackle which attaches to a chain hook. Just inboard of the chain hook I made a splice to connect the second upper leg of the Y. Sorry I don't have all the sizes of shackle, thimble and chain hook, but it's not hard to figure out.

The trip line is just a length of light (strong) line with a Caribbeaner on one end and a lobster pot float on the other end. Mine is 30' long, but that is because I rarely anchor in deeper water. The length should be a bit longer than the deepest water you will anchor in. I use climbing line for mine- doesn't matter as long as it will lift the anchor. Others use fender balls or other floats for the top end - it really doesn't matter much either.
 
Gerry:

Yes it was rough, and no it wasn't any better in 40+ footer.


Jeff:

Thanks....I got to the anchor grounds too late, so finding a spot where paying out the typical scope was next to impossible....unless I headed towards France.... :grin: I originally thought that I barely had enough rhode out to hold bottom, but apparently I held too good...

I'll be a mak'n me up one a them dar bridles right shortly (I've been practicing my South)...

Oh..one more question....do you think the windlass can handle going from a 33 lb to 44 lb anchor without any issues?
 
Pretty much on the money ..

Dominic, SeaGull has you pretty much where you need to be.

I would like to add to his advice from my experience on some of his well made points:

1. The riding bridle is a must with an all chain rode. It can be made to a length of your choosing, but make sure the open bite of the Y will not snag your bow pulpit as the bow works up and down so a little longer is better. If the position of bow pulpit causes snagging, just use one leg of the bridle and run it through the anchor rollers, so make the whole rig one size up in line.

2. The ability to get a typical chain hook to grab the chain and not fall off as the chain goes slack is a trick ... I've had to duck tape the hook on the chain to keep it in place when the rode goes too slack.

3. Setting the hook after the chain is under stain works best. You then hook the rode from chain on deck and set the bridle, THEN take the strain on the bridle by hand by letting out some chain from the windless so it goes slack behind the chain hook.

As for the anchor pennant, I have a small 4 foot pennant that I can clip onto the anchor stock, in the hole provided on most anchors (see your CRQ photo), using a carbineer hook (Stainless) and I set this up before I leave the dock. Its easier this way because the bow stem on the 460 is pretty broad and deep and I don't like hanging off the bow in pitching seas. The other end is clipped to the bow rail by another cabineer.

When I go to anchor I set up a second pennant line to a 12" round vinyl bumper with 3/8" nylon line in a length equal to the bottom depth plus tide height plus my deck height (so I can get the float on deck from the bow) which is about 5 feet. This also helps with strain on the anchor from strong current sweep. I want this float to close to being on top of my hook for several reasons. If my pennant line is too long for the water I'm going to anchor in, I just make a secure hank of the extra length and let the lazy end sink under the float.

When we drop the hook the float goes first then the hook. Once I've backed off say 15 feet from the hook I can see the float and can watch my scope without crew translation. The float also gives other skippers a definitive orientation of where my hook is so they don't drag me loose or worse get wound in my chain.

When it comes time to leave the anchor comes in first then the float. If the hook is stuck I can get the float up and on to the bow. Let out the slack in the line and then pull the hook out back wards.

It has only happened to me once where I couldn't get the hook up and I was in 35 five feet. I was able to toss all the chain rode in to the water, mark my co ordinates and then come back for the whole rig with diving gear. When I got back to my spot my Float was there to greet me, and thus the anchor pennant saved 1200 bucks in ground tackle. (It was wedged firmly between large rocks, the only large rocks around!)

Having two or more anchors aboard of different designs is really advisable. You main anchor if a CRQ should be backed up with say a equal size fold up Fortress and then perhaps a grapple type. And of course, you'll need a second rode made up and ready to run out.

The stock that got bent on your old anchor ... it can be straightened don't trash it as it can become your back up.

Good luck
 
Thanks for the details Chad...

One more thing I forgot to mention...with all the pitching while at anchor, my bow was under a few times. About an hour or so afterwards, while preparing to leave a temp slip at a local Marina, I went to give one long as I pulled off the dock.....nothing but air.....apparently my air horns got filled with water. I tried again a few hours later and still no Noise. I can hear the compressor working but that's it.... I put the hose on the grill in the bow and flushed with fresh water. I'm giving them a few days to dry out before I try them again... I'm hoping they still work...
 
Hey - Dom where are the pictures??
 
Similar experience

Been there, done that and have waxed my car with the T-Shirt on that one.

Here is what I've encountered.

When you bury the bow, the water runs through the external horn grill floods the sound box and blows the trumpets off their retaining gaskets. So first, make sure the trumpets are seated.

Second is that when an all chain rode comes it can let a few pounds of chain slide off towards the horns. I've had my chain pull the clear vinyl air hose off the air manifold for the horns. There was no clamp on mine. So the compressor runs but no horn. I've secured mine better than factory.

To inspect the horns open the access hatches and get a strong flash light down in there and trace the air lines. You should have one airline feed to a T fitting that drives the horns. If any one connection is off it kills the other horn too. Bet you have an air hose dangling.

While there check the trumpets to make sure they are seated in the rubber gaskets firmly. The horns can be working but unless they are in the sound box correctly you won't hear much if anything.

Good hunting. Honk Honk!
 
Thanks again Chad....I was able to lift my anchor hatch and perform a quick cursory inspection to visually see that the air boxes were still secured and in place. I really didn't look with any detail yet, but plan to have my head in the chamber this weekend....I'll pay close attention to finding a dangling air hose...

Mark:
I Didn't really get a chance to take any pics of the airshow, but I do have one of the bent anchor....I'll try and remember to post over the weekend.
 
This seems to be a good representation of the bridle mentioned above....
 
Dom, I was able to get a few pics (before turning green).
 
Dominic,
You can't use that setup .....its from a sail boat !!!!!! :smt043

Off topic, We may be at the "secret spot" this weekend (hope I remember the secret code) on either a 410 EC (Imagine) or a 400DB (Ldy Linda)..
 
Frank:

That's funny you mention that....I edited my original post which made a "remark" about the sail boat....

We'll be at either Tices or the "spot" on Sunday....I'll be the 41 footer with the bent anchor....I've sledge hammered it straight enough to use until the new anchor comes in...give us a shout.


Gerry:
Those pictures are great, but they don't show how rought it actually was....
 
OK....I haven't actually hit the BUY button yet on the new anchor. With the old anchor sledge hammered straight enough to use at the local spots, I have some time to make the final decision.

I really like the look of the Stainless Steel anchors. After all, the anchor (in my case) spends 95% of my boating hours in the pullpit. I'm trying to look at this as an oppurtunity to get a SS anchor for a incrimental outlay of $$$.

I HAVE to buy a new anchor, so upgrading to SS isn't as frivolus as just going out and buying a SS anchor.....at least that's how I can justify it to the admiral.

That said, I don't want to buy an anchor intended to look good that ends up looking bad from use....scratches, pitting, etc...

What I'm really asking here is does anyone have any real world experience with keeping a SS anchor looking good or should I just go with the standard galvanized anchor and use the extra $$ for other toys....

Approx numbers....Standard $175 SS $425 difference...$250
 
I say go for the stainless steel jobby... then us people that have no experience with them can say "I told you so" when it get's scratched up! Great fun!
 
Anchor Size and Air Horns

I'll have to put in a filter that only allows "experienced" folks the ability to say that they told me so.....let's see...here's the first line of code....if userid = "Four Suns" then exit.... :grin:
 
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