I will try to make this as concise as possible. I need help to recover just a bit of a lost boating season!
Problem: Engine will not start
Boat Information: 2000 Sea Ray 210SD, 5.0 EFI
HID: SERV2478I900 Motor: OL626623
For the two years I have owned this boat, I have had absolutely no trouble. We have loved every minute with it.
To start this season in June, I ran the engine in the driveway with no problems on several occasions. I ran on the lake on trip #1 in June all day with no problems, until I turned it off after a five-mile cruise at constant speed. I did not idle to cool down. We sat for 10 minutes with the motor off. Then it would not start. I tried varying throttle, and eventually it started and sputtered for a while. It cleared up enough to idle 200 yards to the marina. The next day, I ran the motor on several occasions on a hose at home, and had no problems. I convinced myself it was a problem with vapor lock (which I could manage) or a faulty IAC (which I would expect to cause some intermittent problems when hot, I could manage with throttle, and I can easily replace the part).
I ran the engine in the driveway with no problems to prepare for a trip. The next week in June, we took the boat on a big camping trip with some other families. No matter what I tried, the boat would not start. There was no hint of a spark / ignition. We ended up camping for 4 days without aboat.
Troubleshooting: I moved throttle to half/full throttle and tried to start, still just cranks. I checked the kill switch, neutral switch, and fuses. I checked the distributor and fuel supply and pressure. I verified that the fuel system was priming with key-on, and the injectors were spraying fuel when I turned the ignition key and turned over the motor. I cleaned some corrosion off the distributor cap. The motor would never start. I decided to get troubleshooting done 'quickly' by a Mercruiser mechanic.
Technician comments, authorized Mercruiser shop (many costly diagnostic labor hours):
Diagnosed engine. Removed spark plugs to find worn plugs, Replaced plugs. Checked fuel pressure. Fuel pressure at 30 psi. Checked basetiming and set to correct setting. Engine timing will not set. Ran multiple tests. Contacted Mercruiser for assistance. Was told to check harmonic balancer for wear. Balancer checked ok. Was advised to check computer for proper operation. Found computer not operating properly.
Recommendation by Mercruiser & Mechanic: Replace engine computer ECM with updated version, conversion kit with new ECM and new wiring harness. P/N 87-2799A01C, $2,589 for parts. Add labor and tax = $3,400. (This will also add several hundred dollars in labor to change the wiring harness)
The shop told me they set timing and could run the motor perfectly. Then after they turn if off for 10 minutes, it would not start.
They told me they checked the distributor, rotor, ignition module, optical sensor, plugs, cables, fuel pump, fuel delivery - all checked okay.
I sent my ECM to OBD Diagnostics, Inc. in California. The ECM is Delphi 16236999, SN866999KA00021015, MEFI3. Bob bench tested the ECM, and stated that "there is nothing wrong with the ECM". Bob's comments: "D074, 2252 starts, 299 hours, no logged codes, good on harness w/ injectors, all sensors good, reflash to DOBC". He stated that he would not expect this ECM to be the problem. He has not seen this issue with a controller. Bob expects the problem may be in the distributor. He suggested connecting A-B, set timing, check with light,use diagnostics tool to see if they agree with each other.
Now that OBD Diagnostics has reflashed the ECM, the mechanic wants to either replace the module with the $2,500 Merc conversion kit + labor, or send me on my way (does not want liability of installing the old ECM now). He does not feel comfortable with the testing setup conducted by OBD Diagnostics.
I will pay for the diagnostics and 8 spark plugs and pick up the boat today.
I need to decide whether to proceed with one of the following:
1) Install the reflashed ECM and continue troubleshooting (I doubt the reflash will have any effect). I will have to find a different mechanic, as I do not have the tools or time to properly troubleshoot this problem.
2) Purchase and try a new (original) ECM from OBD Diagnostics for $1,500. This is a 1:1 swap, with no wiring changes required. This may not fix anything, and I do not know if OBD would let me return it.
3) Other?
The one option I will not consider is to spend another $3,400 on a new Merc ECM kit with labor, which may not fix anything.
I am grasping for any help that could possibly get me back on the water quickly.
Thanks in advance,
Tim
Problem: Engine will not start
Boat Information: 2000 Sea Ray 210SD, 5.0 EFI
HID: SERV2478I900 Motor: OL626623
For the two years I have owned this boat, I have had absolutely no trouble. We have loved every minute with it.
To start this season in June, I ran the engine in the driveway with no problems on several occasions. I ran on the lake on trip #1 in June all day with no problems, until I turned it off after a five-mile cruise at constant speed. I did not idle to cool down. We sat for 10 minutes with the motor off. Then it would not start. I tried varying throttle, and eventually it started and sputtered for a while. It cleared up enough to idle 200 yards to the marina. The next day, I ran the motor on several occasions on a hose at home, and had no problems. I convinced myself it was a problem with vapor lock (which I could manage) or a faulty IAC (which I would expect to cause some intermittent problems when hot, I could manage with throttle, and I can easily replace the part).
I ran the engine in the driveway with no problems to prepare for a trip. The next week in June, we took the boat on a big camping trip with some other families. No matter what I tried, the boat would not start. There was no hint of a spark / ignition. We ended up camping for 4 days without aboat.
Troubleshooting: I moved throttle to half/full throttle and tried to start, still just cranks. I checked the kill switch, neutral switch, and fuses. I checked the distributor and fuel supply and pressure. I verified that the fuel system was priming with key-on, and the injectors were spraying fuel when I turned the ignition key and turned over the motor. I cleaned some corrosion off the distributor cap. The motor would never start. I decided to get troubleshooting done 'quickly' by a Mercruiser mechanic.
Technician comments, authorized Mercruiser shop (many costly diagnostic labor hours):
Diagnosed engine. Removed spark plugs to find worn plugs, Replaced plugs. Checked fuel pressure. Fuel pressure at 30 psi. Checked basetiming and set to correct setting. Engine timing will not set. Ran multiple tests. Contacted Mercruiser for assistance. Was told to check harmonic balancer for wear. Balancer checked ok. Was advised to check computer for proper operation. Found computer not operating properly.
Recommendation by Mercruiser & Mechanic: Replace engine computer ECM with updated version, conversion kit with new ECM and new wiring harness. P/N 87-2799A01C, $2,589 for parts. Add labor and tax = $3,400. (This will also add several hundred dollars in labor to change the wiring harness)
The shop told me they set timing and could run the motor perfectly. Then after they turn if off for 10 minutes, it would not start.
They told me they checked the distributor, rotor, ignition module, optical sensor, plugs, cables, fuel pump, fuel delivery - all checked okay.
I sent my ECM to OBD Diagnostics, Inc. in California. The ECM is Delphi 16236999, SN866999KA00021015, MEFI3. Bob bench tested the ECM, and stated that "there is nothing wrong with the ECM". Bob's comments: "D074, 2252 starts, 299 hours, no logged codes, good on harness w/ injectors, all sensors good, reflash to DOBC". He stated that he would not expect this ECM to be the problem. He has not seen this issue with a controller. Bob expects the problem may be in the distributor. He suggested connecting A-B, set timing, check with light,use diagnostics tool to see if they agree with each other.
Now that OBD Diagnostics has reflashed the ECM, the mechanic wants to either replace the module with the $2,500 Merc conversion kit + labor, or send me on my way (does not want liability of installing the old ECM now). He does not feel comfortable with the testing setup conducted by OBD Diagnostics.
I will pay for the diagnostics and 8 spark plugs and pick up the boat today.
I need to decide whether to proceed with one of the following:
1) Install the reflashed ECM and continue troubleshooting (I doubt the reflash will have any effect). I will have to find a different mechanic, as I do not have the tools or time to properly troubleshoot this problem.
2) Purchase and try a new (original) ECM from OBD Diagnostics for $1,500. This is a 1:1 swap, with no wiring changes required. This may not fix anything, and I do not know if OBD would let me return it.
3) Other?
The one option I will not consider is to spend another $3,400 on a new Merc ECM kit with labor, which may not fix anything.
I am grasping for any help that could possibly get me back on the water quickly.
Thanks in advance,
Tim
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