380 DA Diesel

Dani-Lu

Dani-Lu

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2007
1,352
Delray Beach, Fl
Boat Info
2001 410DA
Engines
3126 Cats
Comparing two 2002 380 Dancers. Assuming all things being equal, including similar usage (400 hrs) on both engines (8.1's gas versus, 3126 diesel Cats). How much more money would it be worth to buy the boat with the diesels? $20k, $30k, $40k, etc.? Please note from a previous thread, I am aware of the advantages and disadvantages of the different engines. Thanks!
 
I am looking for the same boat (probably '00 or '01 though) and am not even considering gas. Looks to me like the asking price difference is around $40K. I think it's a no brainer, and you will get the difference back when you go to sell.
 
Sorry, not necessarily true. I went thru the same exercise and went gas. The difference was more then 60k.! After reading a WSJ article about how diesel will be more (it already is more expensive here in SoCa) more expensive in the future, better do your homework. Unless you are doing major treks, the price difference in fuels is not justified. I also went thru the exercise of matinence and that was about a push. I drove identical 2005 390 DA;s. One gas, one diesel and the performance of the gas boat WAS HUGH over the diesel. Besides, why pay for baggage (interest) of diesel. I paid 250k versus MORE then 310k that they wanted for the diesel version. a no brainer for me. You decide.
 
Just did a little homework to back up my statement. Check out Yachtworld and you will see that '99-'01 gas 380 asking prices range from $128K - $229K. '99-'01 diesel 380 asking prices range from $169K - $229K. That's a $41K difference. To each his own but I don't want to cruise @ 18 knots.
 
Which boat do you think is an 18 kt boat?......The 380DA with Cats is more like a 28-29 kt boat.

I'm a huge diesel fan and would never own a boat this size with gas engines, but they do have their place. It isn't all about fuel cost and economy either. You are looking at '02 models. Say you keep the boat for 5 years. Who do you think is going to be the buyer of a 10 year old gas boat? On the other hand there are plenty of buyers for a 10 year old diesel. Dealers here will not consider a trade on an older gas boat because they don't want the mechanical risk and they cannot get them financed thru normal channels. Dealers are begging diesel owners to trade just to get a used diesel in inventory.

My last point takes a little math to illustrate........but, you are a lot more likely to use and enjoy a diesel boat than a gas model. Say you want to run to the next town over for lunch and its a 45 mile trip...slip to slip that makes it about 2.5 hours or 5 hours of running time at cruise. A gas boat will burn 32 (approx) GPH of $3.95 gasoline so lunch will cost you: 5 hours X 32gph = 160 gallons X $3.95 = $632.

If the boat has 3126 Cats, the numbers would be 5 hours X 22 gph =110 gallons X $2.95/gal = $324.50. Adjust the fuel cost numbers to suit your local situation, but that was what our marina was charging about 2 weeks ago. Either way, it would be an expensive lunch, but you would more apt to make the trip and you would go more frequently with the diesel boat than you would with the gas version. Another interesting fact with Cat diesels is that if you pull the power back 10% to a 75% power setting you reduce the fuel burn to about 16 gph and you still make about 22 kts. Pull the gas boat back 10% and it slows enough that it may not comfortably stay on plane.

As someone else offered, the diesel option is expensive, but the premium stays in the prices and the diesel will always be worth about as much more as you indicate the price difference is. As long as you keep the boat maintained, you will get the premium back when you sell or trade and you will have more buyer at higher prices with the diesel so, even though you have more money invested, the quality of your investment is better.
 
Dani-Lu said:
Comparing two 2002 380 Dancers. Assuming all things being equal, including similar usage (400 hrs) on both engines (8.1's gas versus, 3126 diesel Cats). How much more money would it be worth to buy the boat with the diesels? $20k, $30k, $40k, etc.? Please note from a previous thread, I am aware of the advantages and disadvantages of the different engines. Thanks!
Click to expand...

40 to 60K I think...

5 Years 20 X (Lunch) trips a year = 30k cheaper.....

You decide.

Peter.
 
Frank - I was defending my choice of diesel over gas in the 380. Cruising speed has alot to do with my decision. I'm glad that you chimed in on this, all of the points that you made are the reason I am looking strictly at CAT power. Couldn't have said it better myself!
 
Honestly, knowing what I do now and doing most of my own manitenance, I'd pay significantly more than the differential you have found to get a Caterpillar powered boat.

A 380DA with 3126's has speed and efficiency numbers nobody is going to touch with the weights/power combinations in the current model line up. I think it is one of them most desirable boats anywhere....big enough to be comfortable, small enough to handle easily, quick enough to get you there and a real fuel miser if you pull back the throttles. You made a good choice and I think its one of sea Ray's best ever.
 
If you have the choice and can go with a 380DA with diesel, go for it, even with a $30-40K difference. I have 7,4s in my 370 and I consider that this boat size/weight is at the limit of being usable with gas engines. I cruise at 18-21 knots (3100-3300rpm), 0.7-0,8 mpg . Diesel in a boat like the 380 and up no only provides better fuel savings but also a more pleasant experience in handling the boat at low speed and at cruising speed.
 
Sorry, have to disagree. I seatrialed two exact 2005 390 DA sister boats...one gas, one diesel. The other issues aside, (like paying interest on the 50k difference between the two boats over five years, which means one would paid...what about 20k in interest?...the diesel was a pig in the water visaviz the gas. It was slow to respond to wheel input and took forever to get on plane. The weight difference was hugh and the 390 felt it. No doubt that whenever I move up to something bigger I will get diesel, but the 390 IMHO RUNS much better with gas...but whatever..enjoy!!!
 
Well... the gas vs. diesel debate again on the 380...

I had a 2001 380 DA with gas and to put it bluntly, it was a pig. Great boat design but it was slow and sucked up gas like there was no tomorrow... It was also very anemic trying to dock the thing and always required boosting the throttles. Having to work 2 throttles and 2 transmissions to dock is a challenge. My 480 DB is faster and cheaper to run from point A to point B than that thing was.

I have the fuel burn and cruise specs for the gas and diesel versions of that model and there is a big difference.
 
promocop-was the sea trial of a diesel 390DA your first and only experience with a diesel boat, or have you run other diesels?

regards
Skip
 
Dani-Lu, sorry to have hi-jacked your thread I know we've gotten away from the original question. I know the gas vs. diesel subject has been beaten to death as Gary pointed out. I think the general concensous is that if you are going to keep the boat for awhile and run it frequently than diesel is the choice even if the difference is $30k-$50k. Bottom line is that it's a buyers market and you may be able to get one at a gas price. I don't know much about the 390, are the hulls that different?
 
Just a side note - Mystic Dreamer recently got an '01 380 w/ CATS (400 hours) for $141.5K. No premium for CATS on that deal!
 
My 380 DA Diesel cruises at 20-22 Knots at 24000 RPM's. Average fuel burn is 15 - 18 GPH.

When I bought the boat, my main reason for going for the CAT's was that I wanted the comfort of knowing that when it came time to sell the boat, I would have a leg up on the million other 380's which would be for sale, but with gas engines. I will never be "stuck" with this boat. I also thought at the time that I would own the boat for 5 years and trade up after that.

Well, I have owned the boat for 4 seasons now and I love the boat. The fact that I have the diesel engines makes me feel comfortable and secure in owning the boat for a longer period of time. The engines have 550 hours on them. If I had owned gas engines, I would begin to be concerned about the magic 1000 hour cliff, where people have a sense that a gas engine begins to become a liability. Having the diesel engines, I do not have any anxiety about losing value and resale because of the number of hours on the boat.

I have no plans to trade up in the near future. I feel that if I had gas engines, I would feel more pressured to make a move and sell the boat. I think the diesel engines give you long term piece of mind, that you cannot get from a gas engine boat, especially when the hours begin to increase on the engines, and the years begin to tick off on the age of the boat.

Diesel was definitely a good decision for me.
 
No. I previously had a 340 AJ with diesels. Listen, don't want to beat this anymore...I picked gas because the price was right and couldn't see spending the more then 60k difference between the two. I can make an arugment both ways and in fact went back and forth for two months..end of the day, the gas was way cheaper. Onward.
 
I traded in a 2002 380DA gasser (that I owned for 1.5 years/2 season) for a 2003 410DA diesel. The 410 is a little longer, a little wider and significantly heavier...especially with the diesel....BTW...don't go by the published weights on the SR site/brochures. I had both boats in the yard sling in the same afternoon and according the travellifts scale numbers (not exact numbers, but the difference is what counts) the 410 was about 6000lbs heavier.

6000 lbs heavier is a serious difference....with the wider beam and extra weight, the ride is significantly more stable.

My 380DA had 370HP motors and my 410 has 350HP motors. But torque is what gets this kind of weight up and on plane......and what moves it at slow idle around the docks. When I leave my development with the 410, I have to leave one engine in neutral otherwise I"m going to fast and making a large wake. The 380 actually needed a little throttle to leave the development and maintain steering control.

With the 380 I would cruise at ~3400 RPM and make 21-23 knots burning ~35 Gal/Hr at cruise. With the 410 I cruise at ~2300 RPM and make 21-23 knots burning ~20 Gal/Hr. The diesel fuel delivered to my dock is generally ($0.75-$1.00)/gal less than the gas fuel at the marina docks. (don't use the diesel prices you see on the roadways for comparison)

As to the original question.....I went for the extra $$$$$ for the diesel. I loved my 380, but I hated the fuel economy.....and then when they forced ethanol down my throat, I decided that I had had enough..... I felt that a 410 diesel boat would give me years of service and hold its value better than a 380 gas boat. And, IMHO, a 380 diesel boat will even better holds its value when compared to the same 380 with gas...or least hold the difference. As to Mystic Dreamers recent purchase....that's not typical....I'm sure you can find stories of a 380 gas boat selling for $110K also.....some sellers MUST get out....in general, a similar diesel boat will sell for more than a similar gas boat for one reason....it's worth it!
 
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Find the guy who has owned both gas and diesel boats and still argues that a gas boat is good buy......

Anybody trying to make that argument simply hasn't owned a diesel boat.

If the $$ don't place the boat out of reach, the premium for the diesel boat is worth it.
 
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