340 Sundancer Audio thread..

mnm99

mnm99

Well-Known Member
Oct 2, 2015
2,447
Long Island
Boat Info
2004 340 SeaRay Sundancer
Engines
Twin 8.1 Merc
For all you Audio experts please chime in. Over the winter I'm setting up my system and may need some pointers. To start off I currently have the stock Clarion head unit and stock amps. So far I changed the speakers to 6.5 JL's and (1) 10" sub. The sub is powered by a JL (JX250/1D) amp. Yes I know it's not Marine and I'm changing it out anyway. I just bought a JL MX500/4 for the 4 6.5's and am looking at the JL MX300/1 for the sub. I plan on adding at least 2 , 7.7's speakers somewhere, but not sure yet with another MX500/4. SO...This brings me to my first question.
The MX300 has a fuse rating at 30 Amps
The MX500 has a fuse rating at 50 Amps, I plan on installing 2.
Currently the stock amps and sub amp are tied into the fuse panel lug. My plan was to run a 2 gauge wire to the battery with a 130A fuse next to them and install a distribution block where my amps will be also each fused with the correct amp rating. Sound right so far?
 
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The MX500/4 can safely drive your existing four 6.5" and the the soon to be added pair of 7.7. If you are purchasing through an authorized and credible JL dealer, they should be able to help with the configuration and tuning details. So at first glance, a 2nd 4 chnl amp is not needed.

I would decide on the future of the possible 2nd woofer, prior to purchasing a woofer amp. This will ultimately impact the number of amps needed and the cabling and circuit protection (not a fuse) needed.
 
Why wouldn't a second amp be needed for the 7.7's? The amp I'm installing is the MX500. That a 70x4 amp. I have 4 6.5's already.
I don't think I can install a second 10" sub. I have no room, Only for a 8".
So far I bought my stuff at shows. They have great prices on equipment.
 
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mnm99 said:
For all you Audio experts please chime in. Over the winter I'm setting up my system and may need some pointers. To start off I currently have the stock Clarion head unit and stock amps. So far I changed the speakers to 6.5 JL's and (1) 10" sub. The sub is powered by a JL (JX250/1D) amp. Yes I know it's not Marine and I'm changing it out anyway. I just bought a JL MX500/4 for the 4 6.5's and am looking at the JL MX300/1 for the sub. I plan on adding at least 2 , 7.7's speakers somewhere, but not sure yet with another MX500/4. SO...This brings me to my first question.
The MX300 has a fuse rating at 30 Amps
The MX500 has a fuse rating at 50 Amps, I plan on installing 2.
Currently the stock amps and sub amp are tied into the fuse panel lug. My plan was to run a 2 gauge wire to the battery with a 130A fuse next to them and install a distribution block where my amps will be also each fused with the correct amp rating. Sound right so far?
Click to expand...
I'm far from being an Audio expert, And proved it! Went out bought some Equipment new Stereo, Speakers for the Cockpit area, 12" Subwoofer, And a Amplifier of witch i did use. Ended up getting a family member involved for some unclear wiring. All in all it sounds great !! No you don't want me to chime in LOL
 
Wylie_Tunes said:
@ 4 ohm and 125 x 4 @ 2 ohm

"I don't think I can install a second 10" sub. I have no room, Only for a 8"."

Regardless of what size and location, I would make the decision prior to making the amp choice.
Click to expand...

Yes I will. My speakers are 4ohm. Wouldn't it be 70x4. That's what the amp is specked for
 
AMP specs..4-Channel Class D Full-Range Amplifier, 125 W x 4 @ 2 Ω / 70 W x 4 @ 4 Ω - 14.4V

Still learning thanks. So if I have (2) 4 ohm speakers wired in parallel with this amp, it will put out 62.5 watts on each speaker. The amp will get a little hotter from the 2 ohm load but I will be able to connect 8 speakers. If I connect each speaker to a single output I'll get my 70 watts with the 4 ohm load and the amp should run cooler? Do I have this right?
 
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Yes, those net specs would be correct.

Yes, that amp can safely drive a 2 ohm load on all 4 chnls. As notes above, you can drive your four existing 6.5 and the new 7.7s.

Will the amp generate more heat at a higher load? Sure. Is this always a detriment? No. However, on those compact amps, 3 pair of speakers, or a bridged woofer a single pair, would be my limit.
 
I would give the 4 6.5's and the 1 10in sub a go with the 2 amps you mention. That's a pretty good sounding system in itself. You can always expand from there. I never liked
bridging amps. More heat. I also like JL's 5 channel amps. The MX series amps rated power is at 14.4 volts. So on the hook at 12.xx volts it will be less. I'm skeptical of bigger speakers in the arch because of the limited space behind them. Maybe Wylie can impart some knowledge on that. There's only so much you can do with this kind of cockpit configuration. Space is limited. More speakers may not necessarily sound better.
 
Although my opinion of bridging may differ, nothing here is being proposed or suggested to the bridged. The OP has proposed a dedicated 4 chnl amp for the full range and a dedicated mono for the woofer. So a 2 amp system, which I agree with. I only stated that a 2nd 4 chnl is not needed, to power the 3rd pair of future speakers.

I too, am a huge fan of hybrid 5 chnl amps, are a 6 chnl amp, for in-boats and a woofer. Much less cabling to install, then individual amp. But again, it always best to first work out the drivers, then make the amp choices.

Without knowing what the output of the existing amp is, its hard to make a comparison, so im not saying the mx500/4 is good or bad, just stating it can power 6 speaker with no issue.

As to space in an arch. In terms of measurement, as long as the speaker magnet does not contact the back inside wall of the arch, I see no issue with going from a 6.5" to a 7.7. These arches are typically hollow, so there should be plenty of air space for the woofer to operate to its potential. In reality, both speakers need about the same space.
 
Sorry I didn't clarify. I meant the air space in the arch. I believe technically the coaxial speakers are IB. Yes? Which would in theory have less bass response in a small air space. Correct? Thus the 770 larger surface area would be less beneficial in that location. The lower cockpit locations have pleanty of free air.
 
Apologies for the thread hijack but it's somewhat related.

I was speaking to a JL audio installer at a local boat show recently. I was looking at 4 M770s and a single 10 inch sub upgrade for the cockpit. He said he bridges all the channels on an M600/6 to run the setup as essentially a 3 channel setup and is a typical instal he does.

I'm guessing one bridged channel runs the left pair, another to run the right pair and the remaining bridged channel to run the sub. He said the M770s and 10 inch sub perform better with more amps and gave me a demo which did sound very good.

Does this setup sound doable and reliable? Does bridging the channels still provide the same sound quality?
 
Thats what I understood. Yes, the coaxials are technically IB. And yes, a small cavity behind the speaker can impact the mid-bass produced. IMO, if the 7.7 is going to be impacted by this, then an existing 6.5 was already impacted. The difference in suggested air space, is going to be minimal. The basket displacement between a 6.5 and 7.7 is also minimal. I think most any radar arch is going to have enough internal air space for most any full range coaxial.

if worried, then one could go with the "T" version 7.7 from JL. Thats the model used in their tower pods.
 
No worries. Love talking about this stuff. Nothing wrong with bridging if its done correctly. It does however produce more heat. Imo it harder on the equipment. If I were using that set up my personal choice
Would be the m1000/5. I have a m700/5 with mx speakers in that configuration and it sounds very good. Music and sound is so subjective. Everyone's taste is different. Source material quality varies, cost, brand, The list goes on. In the end. As long as it sounds good to you there is no wrong way.
 
@juggernaut1

There are some details missing from that installers setup. So im not going to say he's wrong, but let me fill in some things I see.

Technically, you could bridge a series pair of speaker on 2 chnls of that amp, say the left, then do the same with the right pair on 2 other chnls. However, there is absolutely ZERO gain in amp output or performance. 8 ohm bridged = 4 ohm stereo wattage output. Unless someone is trying to make speaker wiring easier, the better setup is 4 chnl stereo for the four 4 ohm speaker, then bridge the remaining 2 chnls for the woofer. This makes the 6 chnl amp in to a 5 chnl.

I think this setup could be accomplished with only ONE stereo RCA, but i need to double check. Two at the most, one pair for speakers, 2nd pair for woofer. Bridging the 4 full-range speakers requires splitting the RCA, + that 2nd pair of RCA for the woofer input.
 
Bridging a 4 ohm load is the same at a 2 ohm stereo, so no additional heat As an example 2 speakers on a 2chnl amp compared to a single 4 ohm woofer bridged on the same 2 chnl. Amp sees the same load. So, if your total net output is good, and its a quality amp, heat or reduced sound quality does not worry me.

Thats why i cautioned against running those compact mx 4 chnl amps with all chnls at 2 ohm. Too much load. 3 pair speakers, ok since only 2 chnl @ 2 ohm. Or 1 pair of speakers and 4 ohm woofer bridged on other 2. Again, 2chnl at 4 ohm, 2 chnl at 2 ohm.

Yes, bridging, especially for full-range speakers, has to be done correctly, and most do know how. The results in poor output, poor sound quality and an over worked amp.

If the OP sticks with one 10" 4 ohm woofer, Id consider a 2nd MX500/4 and configure it like this: New pair 7.7's 2 chnl stereo for 70W rms and bridge woofer for 250W rms. Thats nearly a 100W more for the woofer then going with the mx300/1. Still a 2 amp system.

The one downside is that you would then need to split the RCA for the full-range or run a 2nd RCA pair for the 7.7's, as the mx series does not provide a pass through.
 
Wylie_Tunes said:
Bridging a 4 ohm load is the same at a 2 ohm stereo, so no additional heat As an example 2 speakers on a 2chnl amp compared to a single 4 ohm woofer bridged on the same 2 chnl. Amp sees the same load. So, if your total net output is good, and its a quality amp, heat or reduced sound quality does not worry me.

Thats why i cautioned against running those compact mx 4 chnl amps with all chnls at 2 ohm. Too much load. 3 pair speakers, ok since only 2 chnl @ 2 ohm. Or 1 pair of speakers and 4 ohm woofer bridged on other 2. Again, 2chnl at 4 ohm, 2 chnl at 2 ohm.

Yes, bridging, especially for full-range speakers, has to be done correctly, and most do know how. The results in poor output, poor sound quality and an over worked amp.

If the OP sticks with one 10" 4 ohm woofer, Id consider a 2nd MX500/4 and configure it like this: New pair 7.7's 2 chnl stereo for 70W rms and bridge woofer for 250W rms. Thats nearly a 100W more for the woofer then going with the mx300/1. Still a 2 amp system.

The one downside is that you would then need to split the RCA for the full-range or run a 2nd RCA pair for the 7.7's, as the mx series does not provide a pass through.
Click to expand...

It looks like it will work as a 3 channel. It has a dedicated adjustments for the sub. http://mediacdn.jlaudio.com/media/mfg/9013/media_document/live_1/MX500_4_MAN.pdf?1467235412
amp.jpg
 
Wylie_Tunes said:
@juggernaut1

There are some details missing from that installers setup. So im not going to say he's wrong, but let me fill in some things I see.

Technically, you could bridge a series pair of speaker on 2 chnls of that amp, say the left, then do the same with the right pair on 2 other chnls. However, there is absolutely ZERO gain in amp output or performance. 8 ohm bridged = 4 ohm stereo wattage output. Unless someone is trying to make speaker wiring easier, the better setup is 4 chnl stereo for the four 4 ohm speaker, then bridge the remaining 2 chnls for the woofer. This makes the 6 chnl amp in to a 5 chnl.

I think this setup could be accomplished with only ONE stereo RCA, but i need to double check. Two at the most, one pair for speakers, 2nd pair for woofer. Bridging the 4 full-range speakers requires splitting the RCA, + that 2nd pair of RCA for the woofer input.
Click to expand...

Thanks Wylie...yes it is possible something got lost in translation or he didn't give me all the details. Yes I do think you need a y cable RCA in the proposed setup.
 
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