“The Pivot” with sterndrives

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Presentation, May 21, 2008.

  1. Turtlesboat

    Turtlesboat Minister of Media TECHNICAL Contributor

    Feb 4, 2007
    New York City
    1996 450DA, TNT, Caribe dink w/15hp OB.
    3126 427HP TD transmissions
    Who knows, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I've been taught wrong by the most experienced boaters I know. Gary hasn't called me an idiot yet on this issue so I could be on the right track.
     
  2. DragonAnchor

    DragonAnchor New Member

    342
    Oct 22, 2007
    Falls Church, VA
    290 Sundancer 2006
    5.0 BIII
    "Any docking you walk away from is a good one!"


    ... or is that planes and landing?
     
  3. jg300da

    jg300da New Member

    Oct 9, 2006
    None
    Your
    Business
    Folcrums, leverage, and pivot points aside, using a single engine to dock a twin engine boat is to ignore the huge advantages that twins have. Some new twin stern drive boat owners moving up from a single do this because they simply can't grasp the technique of using twins or don't want to spend the time to learn, so they come up with a single engine + steering wheel combo scenario to compensate. That's fine if it works for them but it ignores a huge mechanical advantage.
    The only time I ever used the wheel on my twin stern drive around the dock was to pull the stern into the dock, like at a fuel dock, as Doug illustrated in the 2nd video. Other than that my hands never touched the wheel.
     
  4. RollerCoastr

    RollerCoastr Well-Known Member

    Nov 15, 2007
    Cedar Point, OH / Miami, FL / MacRay Harbor, MI
    1997 400DA
    340HP 7.4 Mercruiser Bluewaters
    Garmin 741, 742, 8212, 24HD, Intellian I2
    1999 280BR
    Twin 250HP Merc 350 Alpha Ones
    I'm impressed with CSR that we had a lengthy debate without anyone getting hostile.

    I don't like the idea of ignoring the benefits of twin engines, and your point to the weak leverage of twin I/O's can also be applied to not using both engines. In the presence of wind and/or current, I wouldn't recommend keeping an engine in neutral.
     
  5. douglee25

    douglee25 Well-Known Member

    Jan 13, 2008
    NJ
    Boatless
    Big ones!
    Good video Doug. Interesting to see how different I/O is as compared to V-drive.

    Doug
     
  6. Turtlesboat

    Turtlesboat Minister of Media TECHNICAL Contributor

    Feb 4, 2007
    New York City
    1996 450DA, TNT, Caribe dink w/15hp OB.
    3126 427HP TD transmissions
    I don't think I'm ignoring the benefits of twins, I think I'm maximizing it by using them in the most efficient way. by using the outside engine, I'm maximizing my leverage. By maximizing leverage, I can use less power and have more control. If you couple that with the wheel of a stern drive boat, you get even more leverage. I rarely ever have to go above idle on one engine to put the boat where i want it.

    When I move up in boat size, the engines being further apart will give me more leverage.
     
  7. Pakmule

    Pakmule Member

    674
    Mar 18, 2007
    St. Albans, VT
    310 Sundancer 2000
    350 Mercruiser w/V-Drives
    You have a wheel and directed thrust and you are ignoring that advantage. ;)
     
  8. grizzer

    grizzer New Member

    8
    Mar 29, 2008
    Milwaukee, WI
    280 Sundancer 2003
    T 4.3 w/ A1
    Doug,

    I appreciate the effort involved to create the videos! :smt038 (Bravo!) As I haven't had much time yet this year to get out on the water, I look forward to getting out this weekend and practicing "the pivot" around the docks.

    Mike
     
  9. gerryb

    gerryb Well-Known Member TECHNICAL Contributor

    Oct 12, 2006
    Somers Point, NJ
    "On Vacation"
    2006 40 Sundancer
    Raymarine E125 & HD Radar + Garmin 5208
    QSB5.9 380 Cummins
    Doug, I think your video is great and proves the theory rather nicely. I assume you had the drives straight and didn't touch the wheel?

    If I did your 'test' with my boat I would have the same result. A bow CAN'T move as much as you have shown if it is anywhere near the 'pivot point' of the boat.

    Stern drives work like tractors, not bow thrusters, and the pivot point is near the drive. The pivot point of propulsion by a thruster, OTOH, is at the opposite end of the thrust.
     
  10. jg300da

    jg300da New Member

    Oct 9, 2006
    None
    Your
    Business
    Re: “The Pivot” with sterndrives

    That's not an advantage, all single stern drive boats have it.
     
  11. CSR_Admin

    CSR_Admin Administrator Staff Member

    Mar 10, 2004
    And all single stern drives have the same advantage.
     
  12. Pakmule

    Pakmule Member

    674
    Mar 18, 2007
    St. Albans, VT
    310 Sundancer 2000
    350 Mercruiser w/V-Drives
    My point is you have a tool and you choose to not use it while simultaneously telling others that they have a tool and don't use it.

    I use a single engine and the wheel but then I have a reason. I keep the other engine in neutral because there is a 50% likelihood that the engine I am using will stall while shifting so I have a spare there just in case.
     
  13. Turtlesboat

    Turtlesboat Minister of Media TECHNICAL Contributor

    Feb 4, 2007
    New York City
    1996 450DA, TNT, Caribe dink w/15hp OB.
    3126 427HP TD transmissions
    I could stick a piece of steel in my mouth and eventually bang a nail into a board, or I can stick that piece of steel on the end of a stick and hammer it in with little effort and great accuracy. Same nail, same steel, same wood, one way is a more efficient use of energy.
     
  14. jg300da

    jg300da New Member

    Oct 9, 2006
    None
    Your
    Business
    ....and with that "interesting" analogy I shall bow out of this thread....
    A happy and safe Memorial Day weekend to all.
     
  15. Nehalennia

    Nehalennia Well-Known Member

    Aug 22, 2007
    Marysville, WA
    2001 310DA twin 350 MAGs, Westerbeke 4.5KW
    Twin 350 MAG V-drives
    I'll have to make a video of "How to walk your single screw boat sideways in tight quarters". I haven't done it in a twin in awhile..but I can do it with the single.....and there's lots of steering involved.

    It's a CSR Rodeo..............yeeha!
     
  16. unlvrebel

    unlvrebel New Member

    341
    Mar 24, 2008
    Clearwater, FL
    2005 220 Sundeck
    2002 Dodge Durango 5.9L
    5.0 Merc
    Might want to spell Sea Ray correctly though...

    Sorry, its the auditor in me...
     
  17. Nehalennia

    Nehalennia Well-Known Member

    Aug 22, 2007
    Marysville, WA
    2001 310DA twin 350 MAGs, Westerbeke 4.5KW
    Twin 350 MAG V-drives
    Who?
     
  18. CSR_Admin

    CSR_Admin Administrator Staff Member

    Mar 10, 2004
    So we can put a hammer in our mouth, turn the wheel and use shifters to move the bow around while putting up drywall? Do I have this right? :smt101 :grin:
     
  19. Hampton

    Hampton Air Defense Dept TECHNICAL Contributor

    Nov 26, 2006
    Panama City, Fl
    2008 44 Sedan Bridge
    Cummins QSC-500's
    Straight Drives
    In my docking situation, backing in is a must. With the breakers 25' in front of my boat (once in the slip), I can never get moving to use the keel of the boat for steering. I have to rotate just outside my slip, then back in at speeds generally less than the wind. As the wind frequently crosses the bow as I rotate, it gets quite tricky.
     
  20. Woody

    Woody Well-Known Member

    Nov 20, 2007
    N. Wisconsin/Lk Superior
    2005 420DA
    Cummins 6CTA8.3
    Not quite right. You forgot that once your done hanging all the sheetrock the dentist will take you for a ride on his new boat.
     

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