Help me find the "perfect" boat...

Well, its been a little over 7 years since selling our 03 340DA, a pretty lackluster 7 years I must say. Selling it was definitely bittersweet but it also has given us time to consider what we really enjoyed doing with our free time. Ultimately, I'd rather pack up and move west for 10yrs or so to enjoy the outdoors while I'm physically able to ski, hike, etc., but the reality is that it cannot happen without a career change and I'm not trying to do that. So, for the last several years we've done tons of overland backcountry based travels and even managed to start a new company based on it in doing so. But every endless highway to get there had us discussing where we'd like to be once I hit 40 next year and it has always been either out west or back in a boat. With the prospects of living under western skies dwindling away, having another big boat has taken over my thoughts recently. (Full disclaimer- Wife says I'm in full blown Mid-life Crisis mode, haha) I've also been away from CSR for much of the last 7 years too so I'm happy to see many of the same, familiar names still here and hopefully I can find answers here based on others experiences. Because this time around, I need the "perfect" boat....
So I've been in contact with my broker who I've both bought and sold through, but he's limited with ideas of what will suit us currently. At least I do have a broker that I 100% trust to help me find the right one once we decide what exactly that is. Following is a list of our desires and needs.

Theres myself, the angry wife, 3 screaming kids and 2 stupid dogs LOL, please tell me Gary is still around...

Well, theres really only 2 kids now as one has left for college and has seemingly disassociated himself with us except for when he needs money, go figure..

I'm 6'6" tall, if the bed is smaller than that then it's no bueno, feet can hang off though . My 12yr old daughter is nearly 6' tall already and isn't that keen on sharing a bed with her 6yr old sister so theres that to deal with. Oddly enough, my wife is the easiest to please here. With that in mind, here's what we want

We want a weekend "condo" that is comfy enough to spend 2-4 weeks at a time on.
35-40 feet roughly.
Long fuel range, 250+ miles ideally.
Fishable would be really, really nice but I do have a 23' CC I can keep to fish.
Diesels? maybe, probably, but they scare me $$$$
Reliability and quality is a concern, especially long term as I plan to keep it long term.
Easy maintenance, I like to do anything I can myself.
Not sure about a bridge boat even though I know it'll be better as a condo.
And easily handled by 2 people.

Ideally, I'd love a 98+ hardtop 370 express cruiser. But, I'm not sold on the convertible dinette for the kids, not even sure its big enough for a 6 footer plus one other. And I wouldn't even consider a 370 gasser but the 3116 cats are not highly praised by most... We love the helm seating, the open cockpit, its very seaworthy and its highly fishable. Most 370's I'm seeing are really showing their age now but I'm sure there are some very well kept ones to be found. Knowing that, I've also really taken a liking to the Pursuit (Tiara) 3800 express but even at 15yrs old they are very pricey. The cabin layout with the Pullman bed is ideal for us though, much more so than the 370EC. The wifey really likes the Pursuit in pics, its fancy...

Other boats on my to see list include the 340AJ, 410EC, 420DA, 400 sedan bridge, Pursuit 3400 express. I realize every one of those should be diesel powered.

And, I'm not opposed to an outboard powered walk around such as a GW 360... Any other ideas of where to start looking? Theres not too much on my list thats available to see locally but we're spending some time on Marco Island next month and would like to put together a list of boats to check out while in Fl.

Thanks SB

How about a boat with this as a mater stateroom?

The 40 or 42/44 Sedan bridge would offer a nice master stateroom and the guest stateroom has twin beds so no need for the girls to share. They both have a pull out sofa in the salon for your third child. Both have two full heads that the 370 DA/Express will not. There is decent cockpit space on both boats for light inshore fishing. Diesel is definitely the way to go. Our current boat is our first diesel and all the great benefits people shared about diesels were accurate.

Hope this helps. Good luck with your search.

Converse48 said:

How about a boat with this as a mater stateroom?
View attachment 48550

Click to expand...

That is a sweet looking stateroom but, how does Mater get in there?



Sent from my SM-J320V using Tapatalk

Reading this i was thinking of the 48 MY that Converse 48 is selling the whole time. Its well updated, a ton of room, heck i have told my wife multiple times during our boat search that I wish we want a 48 MY because I know a great deal on one.

SB, It sounds like the "Motor Yacht" line might be your best? course. Many sizes and they are most def like a condo.
I was on one last fall and loved it!!! They had just got back from the Bahamas and loved it. I believe it was a 40 footer
but I could be wrong. The space in it was truly very good. My wife wanted one like it bad. The people around our old boat
with 3116 Cats loved them! I know the 3126 i had were great. I am currently looking for a Pocket Cruiser for many
reasons. As Sherlock says "The game is a foot". Good luck on finding the perfect boat, JC

I guess I need to rephrase my needs a bit. As nice as the master stateroom is on a motor yacht, it's just not us. We all really like outdoor space and I just can't see myself leaving the slip too often in a boat like that, looks a bit intimidating to handle for two people. We were out every day and sometimes more than once per day on the weekends with our 340 as it was so easy to handle around the docks.

So, let's nix the "floating condo" statement. Whatever we get will be used in that sense but I prefer the express style for the outdoor space. I've decided I'm pretty dead set on at least minor fishing capabilities like bottom fishing. I can do without trolling since it's 50 miles to the gulf stream for me anyhow. I'm thinking nearly any sedan bridge type boat would be ok for that since they have a fairly open cockpit with fold away seating usually. But what boats in the sundancer lineup would lend to fishing a bit? My 340 was horrible, just too much upholstery back there and too much transom to work over. The older 380da (up to 04?) looks like the seats rest on legs, do they fold up and out of the way? I also really like that there are plenty of them with diesels out there for the range.

Then there's the 340da with the sportsman package... it would probably be just fine for most of our uses but I'd like to occasionally be able to run out 50 miles to the 100' line to drop down on grouper but the range with 8.1's is horrible. And the 340 with yanmars seems to be a unicorn boat, I've heard of them but never seen one.

I really need to go see a 370EC as it's what I really want in pics at least. The age of them doesn't bother me but the horror stories I've read elsewhere about the 3116 cats has me wondering if it's even worth pursuing. Are they really as bad as many make them out to be? What would it cost to replace one roughly?

I should probably also mention my budget which is preferably under 150k. I'd go higher for the right boat but 200 is the absolute max.

Newbie, You have been on Csr just a little less time than me(10 years). FrankW has done a multitude of post on the Cats 3116. Others on this
board have years of experience with that motor. I am sure they will post their thoughts. IMHO a well surveyed Cat 3116 should serve you well.
Fair Winds and Good luck. JC

I am a Huge Sea Ray fan but a Tiara may be better suited for what you want to do as well. When we were shopping we looked at 380's, 410's, and ended up with the 460 but none of those boats are great for fishing. Like you said there is upholstery everywhere.

The week or 2 at the boat comment got me thinking but that's really a long time for a Sundancer or Express. The 460 does give you privacy with the midcabin door so it's doable but the fishing throws me for a loop.

This may be crazy but I'm wondering if you can temporarily remove the aft seating in the boats that have legs on the bench for when you want to fish on a boat that has that style.

I'll also throw this out, if you and the Mrs want to see/use our 460 for a day or 2 buy a cheap flight to Houston and I'll show you around. You definitely get a lot for your your money on the 460 and they are all diesel.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

JC3 said:

Newbie, You have been on Csr just a little less time than me(10 years). FrankW has done a multitude of post on the Cats 3116. Others on this
board have years of experience with that motor. I am sure they will post their thoughts. IMHO a well surveyed Cat 3116 should serve you well.
Fair Winds and Good luck. JC

Click to expand...

Thank you.

To briefly summarize the many "Frank" responses to this question: The issues that some of those motors had during the early stages of their lives, happened when they had low hours on them. Any issues would have been discovered/resolved by now. They are great power plants.

In 2003 We decided we wanted a bigger boat. We made a list of all the things we wanted and handed it to every sales person we met. At the bottom of the list in BOLD was.
IF YOU CALL ME WITH A BOAT THAT DOES NOT HAVE THESE FETURES I WILL NEVER TALK TO YOU AGAIN.
I did not state year, make or condition but stated a max price.
I did have some sales people that called I never talked to again.
But in 2005 I got a call from a sales person in Seattle saying he had a boat with all the things we wanted and he did. We bought it and still have it. We have put over 2,000 hours on the engines and gone to Alaska with it.

JC3 said:

Newbie, You have been on Csr just a little less time than me(10 years). FrankW has done a multitude of post on the Cats 3116. Others on this
board have years of experience with that motor. I am sure they will post their thoughts. IMHO a well surveyed Cat 3116 should serve you well.
Fair Winds and Good luck. JC

Click to expand...

Thanks, I'm researching them more now and it seems that most people refer to their issues from back in the early 90's when there were a handful of "soft blocks". Reading about them on THT gives an anxiety equivalent of looking up symptoms on WebMD...

cwiert said:

Thank you.

To briefly summarize the many "Frank" responses to this question: The issues that some of those motors had during the early stages of their lives, happened when they had low hours on them. Any issues would have been discovered/resolved by now. They are great power plants.

Click to expand...

Hows the maintenance on them? I did pretty much everything on my 8.1's and would like to be able to do the same this go around. I realize certain things like valve adjustments are better left for the pros but I don't mind getting dirty. Care to share a rough estimate of what your annual maintenance expenses have been with yours?

NotHerDecision said:

I am a Huge Sea Ray fan but a Tiara may be better suited for what you want to do as well. When we were shopping we looked at 380's, 410's, and ended up with the 460 but none of those boats are great for fishing. Like you said there is upholstery everywhere.

The week or 2 at the boat comment got me thinking but that's really a long time for a Sundancer or Express. The 460 does give you privacy with the midcabin door so it's doable but the fishing throws me for a loop.

This may be crazy but I'm wondering if you can temporarily remove the aft seating in the boats that have legs on the bench for when you want to fish on a boat that has that style.

I'll also throw this out, if you and the Mrs want to see/use our 460 for a day or 2 buy a cheap flight to Houston and I'll show you around. You definitely get a lot for your your money on the 460 and they are all diesel.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

Yeah, the Tiara/Pursuit 3800 is at the top of my list, and budget... Taking out the seats on the 380 etc is definitely an option for me if it is even possible. Realistically I'll probably fish it with any seriousness only 4-5 times per year anyhow so I wouldn't mind having to remove some seating occasionally to do so.

Thanks for the offer to show me around yours. The 460 is a beautiful boat but more than we need, or so I think. It's an eye opener for sure when comparing what you get for the price of one compared to something like the Tiara.

I recently bought my 3126 powered 410 and was also leary about things I heard about them. We would have liked to get an 05 or so 420 for the Cummings and hardtop but with one in college and another one looking at colleges it just wasn't in the boat budget.
Anyway, after doing a fair amount of research and talking to Frank my opinion about the Cats changed and I'm very happy that I went for this boat.
My 410 actually has two rod holders back in the corners of the cockpit and although I don't plan to fish it regularly, I do intend to clear the cockpit and give it a try once or twice in the late fall. While I'll be more careful about slopping it up than I am on the 22' Eastern we normally fish, the creature comforts and ability to warm up on the 410 will be worth it. I just have to make sure my wife doesn't find any chunks of bait or fish guts anywhere.

Enjoy your search. Ours, finally, is closing in on the end! The CATs either 3116 or 3126 are good engines. As I searched around most all the diesels in sea rays had some form of an issue... and if they are not taken care of then any engine will be a problem. That being said, as others have noted the soft blocks were an early issue and a blow by (compression) test, along with oil samples, will give you clues as to the condition of the engine. The serial number range of the soft blocks is known and is easily validated through CAT. When I spoke to CAT about the engines I looked at, they said they were skeptical, as the engines had so many hours on them that issue would have long ago come up.

As far as maint. Most (if not all) of the diesel sea rays have the oil changer system, so that makes getting the 6.5 gals out and into each engine easier. From my limited research it seems that CAT is particular about the oil and recommends their SAEO 30 which around me retails for $22 a gal. The zincs (there are 11) are another maint item, once you find them I think it's not a big deal to change them... The 500,1000 hr valve resets and adjustments are best left up to CAT, but the rest seems from what I've researched pretty user friendly!!! I hope to have first hand experience in another month or so...

Around the 370 EC. We used to dock behind one with gas engines long ago. She was a beautiful boat with great bow flare and a huge beam and wide open cockpit. She was a salty looking boat. Her name was Dallas and I loved going to my boat to just sit in the cockpit and stare at the 370 EC. While above deck she might be perfect the trade off (there is always a trade off...) is her cabin lacked the accommodations that are usually found in sundancers. The aft cabin was a cramped 1/4 berth barely large enough for one person. The dinette was smaller. The berth in the bow was good sized. For being a 37 it was all open much like my 330 or your 340. So if you are looking for solid doors and staterooms, you won't find it in the sea ray. There might have been an option, I'm not sure...

Tiara should give you the private master at least. From memory looks like the 4000 mid-cabin has a sundancer feel mid-cabin. To my eyes the 3800 or 4100 open have the better lines. You lose the aft cabin so you have to decide whether you want that or not.

Best of luck to you! Enjoy!!

Converse48 said:

How about a boat with this as a mater stateroom?
CLIP

Click to expand...

Ironically, your sneaker was the first thought that came to me.

IMHO, if the OP is looking to spend a month at a time on his boat, yours is the minimum size I would be considering. A McKinna or a 58 Hatt LRC should be in the mix as well. My 2 cents.

David,
The OP has stated a preferred budget of <$150k but up to $200k max. I believe that eliminates these boats from the conversation.

Sent from my SM-J320V using Tapatalk

Zach312 said:

Reading this i was thinking of the 48 MY that Converse 48 is selling the whole time. Its well updated, a ton of room, heck i have told my wife multiple times during our boat search that I wish we want a 48 MY because I know a great deal on one.

Click to expand...

Hi Zack - do you think that 48 is still for sale ?

This year I sold my 2000 340 DA bought my 2000 400 Sedan Bridge. She has the 3116 engines and they just purr along. Good power plants for this boat. 18-22 GPH based on the cruise RPM averaging 20-21 kts. Engine room access is wonderful. Maintenance is basically change the fluids and the anodes and replace filters. Along with changing the impellers...
Having two staterooms and two heads both with separate showers is great! She came with a removable table for the salon (along with the dinette). One of my dock mates made a base that matches the woodwork for that table. Now I can use the table in the salon or out in the cockpit. Some of the sedan bridges have a bench in the cockpit - I only have folding seats so plenty of room for fishing.
Handling is great around the dock but you must be aware of the wind as there is a large sail area. As Frank W. says "Make sure she is pointed where you want her to go before you put her in gear... because she will move immediately". Big difference in momentum going from a ~16,000 boat to a ~27,000 boat. And in your price range.