410 Sundancer/Express Cruiser and 400 Sundancer/Express Cruiser **Official Thread**

You are missing the floor flange seal - gotta replace those also.
And if you're in that deep the ball and ball shaft?

the foam floor seal, right? It’s backordered so they’ll come eventually.

The ball snaps back on both with authority but maybe you’re right, in that far and all apart I should probably do them. Cartridge too? They seem to come as a kit
 
the foam floor seal, right? It’s backordered so they’ll come eventually.

The ball snaps back on both with authority but maybe you’re right, in that far and all apart I should probably do them. Cartridge too? They seem to come as a kit

Definitely replace the ball and shaft and the mating seal.

You can buy just the ball seal separate as long as the (ball itself is in a good smooth condition), and rebuild the shaft cartridge if parts are a problem. That shaft has 2 o-rings that will give you a slow leak down if /when they start to wear/fail.
 
Or you can go for whats behind door #3!

upload_2022-9-17_9-30-59.png
 
After inflation its only .015 boat bucks...
Yea the Amazon price for that flange seal is quite a bit higher than from a Dometic dealer but they have it.
I have found over the years and boats that about half my vacuum problems were that foam seal.
 
Yea the Amazon price for that flange seal is quite a bit higher than from a Dometic dealer but they have it.
I have found over the years and boats that about half my vacuum problems were that foam seal.

$8 at marinesan, just backordered. I have until April 15, 2023 to get this done so I'll wait it out. Maybe if it takes long enough I'll do this job in january when the poo is frozen :)
 
So it is two steps forward, one step back with my boat.

Ordered the gasket for the oil return tube, waited... picked it up from Quinn. turned out to be incorrect (oval hole rather than round hole) despite it being the part listed on Cat website as the correct part for my serial #. Somehow found one that appeared correct, took a chance and ordered it. It was correct.

Friday night my cousin and I decided to put everything back together. At literally the last minute he randomly decided to take a closer look at the fitting and guess what? it is cracked (see photo). Boy would we have been confused had we proceeded with the install and the engine started spewing oil again which it surely would have.
elbow_crack.JPG


Sooo, back to the website, find the part. Availability is "contact dealer." So call placed to Quinn. There is one available... in Russia. So now I wait again, for probably two weeks. Sigh.

In the meantime, on the battery front. My "rescued" batteries are just not performing that well... so as I was advised to do on this forum originally I decided to just replace them all. Found 4 Duracell AGM's in stock locally so I replaced them all yesterday. For those keeping score that is, remove all 4 orig batteries, 3 days coaxing them to charge, re install all 4 orig batteries. Buy 4 new AGM's, remove all 4 orig batteries again, install 4 new AGM's.

The last removal and install done yesterday was one of the most physically miserable things I have ever done. Once I was finished I swore never to do that task again. I switched the breaker back on, checked the charger and voila! 14 volts to both port and stbd banks! then I noticed the gen battery was dead as a doornail. Somehow even though I knew this would be the case I had forgotten about it.

So it was right back to the task I only 10 minutes prior had sworn to never do again. Had to remove one stbd battery to make room to get the dead gen battery out. back to batteries plus for a grp 27 and put everything back in. then back home to pop some aspirin and lie on the couch.

Now I am done with batteries I hope.
 

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Whelp after a couple months of waiting to get them installed my Fox Gateways are now functional (mostly). So far the bluetooth works perfectly but only the starboard engine is currently sending data on the NMEA network. The jury is out on whether this is a dip switch issue or not enough power on my NMEA network for a 20' run plus the connections in the ER. Hoping that's cleared up this week yet.

Aside from the connectivity issue it was quite eye opening to take a cruise with her this weekend. At my typical cruise speed of 22-23kts, 3600 rpm +/-, she's pulling 40-41GPH. This was half fueled, no dinghy. I backed it down to 19-20kts and the flow rate dropped to 29GPH. 15% +/- reduction in speed, 25% reduction in fuel. I didn't expect quite that much!

I didn't have the heart to go any slower...knowing all you prior posters were probably right about getting this thing above 1MPG at some ludacris speed like 17kts or something :)
 
Whelp after a couple months of waiting to get them installed my Fox Gateways are now functional (mostly). So far the bluetooth works perfectly but only the starboard engine is currently sending data on the NMEA network. The jury is out on whether this is a dip switch issue or not enough power on my NMEA network for a 20' run plus the connections in the ER. Hoping that's cleared up this week yet.

Aside from the connectivity issue it was quite eye opening to take a cruise with her this weekend. At my typical cruise speed of 22-23kts, 3600 rpm +/-, she's pulling 40-41GPH. This was half fueled, no dinghy. I backed it down to 19-20kts and the flow rate dropped to 29GPH. 15% +/- reduction in speed, 25% reduction in fuel. I didn't expect quite that much!

I didn't have the heart to go any slower...knowing all you prior posters were probably right about getting this thing above 1MPG at some ludacris speed like 17kts or something :)

I had the same experience on our 290 with them. We were actually getting way better mpg at higher speeds even though the engines sounded like they were working harder
 
Whelp after a couple months of waiting to get them installed my Fox Gateways are now functional (mostly). So far the bluetooth works perfectly but only the starboard engine is currently sending data on the NMEA network. The jury is out on whether this is a dip switch issue or not enough power on my NMEA network for a 20' run plus the connections in the ER. Hoping that's cleared up this week yet.

Aside from the connectivity issue it was quite eye opening to take a cruise with her this weekend. At my typical cruise speed of 22-23kts, 3600 rpm +/-, she's pulling 40-41GPH. This was half fueled, no dinghy. I backed it down to 19-20kts and the flow rate dropped to 29GPH. 15% +/- reduction in speed, 25% reduction in fuel. I didn't expect quite that much!

I didn't have the heart to go any slower...knowing all you prior posters were probably right about getting this thing above 1MPG at some ludacris speed like 17kts or something :)
I've heard there are some boats that drop down to 6 or 8 knts and do really well with fuel burn. We have a bunch of friends with sails on their boats and they burn almost nothing (in the 13 hours it takes them to cross the lake) ;)
 
Whelp after a couple months of waiting to get them installed my Fox Gateways are now functional (mostly). So far the bluetooth works perfectly but only the starboard engine is currently sending data on the NMEA network. The jury is out on whether this is a dip switch issue or not enough power on my NMEA network for a 20' run plus the connections in the ER. Hoping that's cleared up this week yet.

Aside from the connectivity issue it was quite eye opening to take a cruise with her this weekend. At my typical cruise speed of 22-23kts, 3600 rpm +/-, she's pulling 40-41GPH. This was half fueled, no dinghy. I backed it down to 19-20kts and the flow rate dropped to 29GPH. 15% +/- reduction in speed, 25% reduction in fuel. I didn't expect quite that much!

I didn't have the heart to go any slower...knowing all you prior posters were probably right about getting this thing above 1MPG at some ludacris speed like 17kts or something :)

I'd want to know if the port gateway will communicate using the starboard T. I have 8 devices on my network with a 20 footer in the backbone without issue, so I wouldn't think you have a power problem...

3,600 is only returning .63 sMPG...? I wonder if late-season bottom growth has something to do with that.

My typical cruise speed is now down to 17 MPH. Going that slowly took some getting used to, but the lack of noise and the high efficiency spoiled me in no time. The engines just purr at 2,850 and while she can't hit 1 MPG on-plane, she gets closer than I ever thought possible. (I can hit .84 when I have everything dialed-in just right)
 
I'd want to know if the port gateway will communicate using the starboard T. I have 8 devices on my network with a 20 footer in the backbone without issue, so I wouldn't think you have a power problem...

3,600 is only returning .63 sMPG...? I wonder if late-season bottom growth has something to do with that.

My typical cruise speed is now down to 17 MPH. Going that slowly took some getting used to, but the lack of noise and the high efficiency spoiled me in no time. The engines just purr at 2,850 and while she can't hit 1 MPG on-plane, she gets closer than I ever thought possible. (I can hit .84 when I have everything dialed-in just right)

So perhaps swap out a Tee or a drop cable before going crazy? Thanks for the tip...good stuff.

Yeah, it had been a few weeks since I had her on plane so it may not have been my best effort. But I generally take my longer runs full on fuel and with my 500lbs of dinghy on the back so it's probably pretty representative of my likely case performance?

17mph...man alive. If I'm getting passed by sailboats I'm going to feel pretty bad about myself :)
 
I use ablative paint, so I have to put some distance behind us before I see my peak efficiency numbers. Crazy-slow is crazy efficient, but her next-best speed is fast. (I just don't like doing that to my old engines). I can carry a lot of fuel and water and still get low .7's at a fast cruise.

lol. yeah, it's slow. I ran with 6 other boats up to the islands a few weeks ago. Everyone else was tied up and done by the time I got back the marina, but why the hell rush home? My engines were happy, my crew was happy and my wallet was happy.

So if you're only seeing 1 gateway, I assume you haven't configured all the Garmin displays the way you want them? Remember that many of the options are only available when the gateways are communicating, so that "demo" mode comes in handy.
 
We cruise around 18-19mph, it still feels super slow and the rated cruise is up to 23-24mph but I’ve taken a liking to the slow cruise. Engines are much quieter and I’m generally not in a hurry
 
I use ablative paint, so I have to put some distance behind us before I see my peak efficiency numbers. Crazy-slow is crazy efficient, but her next-best speed is fast. (I just don't like doing that to my old engines). I can carry a lot of fuel and water and still get low .7's at a fast cruise.

lol. yeah, it's slow. I ran with 6 other boats up to the islands a few weeks ago. Everyone else was tied up and done by the time I got back the marina, but why the hell rush home? My engines were happy, my crew was happy and my wallet was happy.

So if you're only seeing 1 gateway, I assume you haven't configured all the Garmin displays the way you want them? Remember that many of the options are only available when the gateways are communicating, so that "demo" mode comes in handy.

I haven't done anything other than play around with the default display to swap around some of the smaller gauge sets. What's strange is that on the Garmin both sides of the gauges are active but it's only coming from one engine (strbrd). It's showing exactly the same oil pressure, coolant temp and RPM's for both. I only know it's strbrd based on revving the engine.

Oddly...the fuel flow rates appear correct on the Garmin. Unless it's simply doubling the strbrd flow rate? That would be odd though...
 

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