Metal Flakes in my Cooling System. Manifold? Should I worry?

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97Alpha175

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May 10, 2022
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I just bought a 1997 Sea Ray 175 3.0 merc Alpha One. I was just feeling how soft the water hoses were by squeezing them and the elbow at the pump crunched. I took it off and found this:

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Should I pull the manifold and other cooling parts clean or replace? Is this the manifold flaking apart? Is there a better manifold?
I am new to boating and a nightmare would be overheating due to clogged cooling. I have an old boat and I want to keep it running smooth and clean.
Any help is very much appreciated!! Thanks in advance.
 
Replace all you can afford to. The spring is obviously rotted, inspect/replace everything if you want a problem free season.
 
Do you know any good parts websites? For factory and for aftermarket (cheap stuff)? Also I am not sure what to inspect exactly.
 
Take the parts off and run them down to NAPA. they will be able to help you out in most cases. If you have this with a close cooling system, there hasn't been antifreeze in there in some time. If this is raw water cooled, it doesn't look like it's being flushed very well.
 
Should I take out the water pump? I would guess I should replace it if it is out. It seems to be doing its job, but it is first in line for parts to take off with the manifold.
I do not think this boat takes coolant. Maybe in the winter (antifreeze). If that was supposed to be coolant I am nervous about this motor..
 
okay just barely started to read about closed cooling. It might have the tank on the back. I will have to check tomorrow. Great....
 
The closed cooling system is actually a good thing. I have it on the 19' runabout. The biggest issue I have is the heat exchanger. Just because it's another maintenance thing. I remove it and take the end caps off and wash it really good during winter maintenance. I didnt when we first bought the thing and it was almost completely plugged with sand and mud. When I figured it out, it needed to be completely rebuilt. And that was a lower cost than a replacement for a 70s era boat.

I use dexcool in it now with a water pump lubricant additive. Just because I like the added protection for the pump that is very hard to find. Not much support for that ol Merc 470 Frankenstein motor.
 
I am sure having a closed system is great, I just failed to inspect it when I bought the boat haha (if it has one). Hopefully a good flush will clear it out one way or another. I do not know if it has one but we will see tomorrow. We will see if this has happened to someone else on the forum.
 
Yeah, I had not a single clue when dad brought home the run about. I ran it for two years before I did anything proper. And no real forum to go to. Bought the Sea Ray and found this forum. And there is some folks that have so much info, they are better than the paper manuals. A lot of great folks, a few jackwagons and two ugly chicks.
 
JHornsby3 said:
The closed cooling system is actually a good thing. I have it on the 19' runabout. The biggest issue I have is the heat exchanger. Just because it's another maintenance thing. I remove it and take the end caps off and wash it really good during winter maintenance. I didnt when we first bought the thing and it was almost completely plugged with sand and mud. When I figured it out, it needed to be completely rebuilt. And that was a lower cost than a replacement for a 70s era boat.

I use dexcool in it now with a water pump lubricant additive. Just because I like the added protection for the pump that is very hard to find. Not much support for that ol Merc 470 Frankenstein motor.
Click to expand...
Is that one of those 4cyl. with one Ford V-8 head on it?
 
If you had a closed cooling system and removed the circulating hose, antifreeze would have poured out. In your first picture orientation... the left side of the hose (where the rusty stain is) is actually the "bottom" of the hose elbow? That would mean there was a little standing water in that hose (common). If you DO have a closed cooling system, it makes no sense that someone would have drained it out.

The crunchiness you felt is very normal. It's from the scaling/sediment build up that collects around the spring. Zooming in on your pictures, the spring actually doesn't look too bad, at all. I suspect all you're seeing is typical scaling flakes from the inside of the engine block. It's NOT from your manifold - that's further downstream.

Run the engine, see how the temps go. Then drain the block and keep poking the drain hole to make sure it'c clear. You MAY want to pre-emptively change the impeller if you don't know when it was done last. If you do want to check something, pull the exhaust elbow off and check the cooling passages.
 
techmitch said:
Is that one of those 4cyl. with one Ford V-8 head on it?
Click to expand...

Yes it is. It's been an ok motor but I don't have much trust in it. I had it up plane once. After I learned some about it, I just putter around with it. That and I don't get to too many places with it that I can run faster than a good cruise.
 
The 3.0 is a basically a Chevy 153 CI (Chevy II Nova engine) opened up to 180 CI in the Mercruiser form. And is a very common engine that has been around a long time. You could say it is 1/2 of a 327. It is also a very reliable engine and a staple in the 4 cyl line up of engines. Replacement parts are readily available, using the 153 Nova engine as a reference, and working on them is pretty straight forward.

Changing the engine circulating pump can be a chore, as the ones I had, you needed to remove the front motor mount to change the pump. I would change any questionable hoses, but once the inside of the engine is scaled up, not much you can do about it. Yours definitely looks (from the pictures) like it's raw water cooled (not closed cooling). I know the Closed Cooling was available, but have never seen it on a 3.0, since that was an entry level setup.

Have had a couple of them and they will take a lot of abuse.
 
Ok there is no closed cooling system. I ran it for 2 hours on the water varied rpm and temp stayed around 140 ish.

I have no cooling issues to speak of other than the flakes in that hose. I am thinking of just replacing all the rubber i can find. Is that too much? LAZY DAZE the spring feels good when I was pulling on it and appeared to be just surrounded with junk.. I am guessing a new hose comes with the spring.
All the hoses really look ok and feel ok, bellows are firm but no cracking. The shift cable boot is cracking.. I think all these rubbers are on their way out though...

Is there a rubber kit or something like that with all belows and hoses?

I have not ordered any parts yet (know any good sites I am guessing I will be spending $1000 on various parts/stuff). Should I only go with merc parts? If not should some be merc like the bellows or shift cable boot. I do not think the water circulation pump is a big deal to replace, but it works. Same as the thermostat. The housings look bad from corrosion, but they are working.

Thanks again, I feel a little better now. I will pull of the exhaust elbow and take a look this evening and pull some hoses and inspect them.

Anyone have a cooling diagram? 97 175 with merc 3.0lx alpha one 2nd gen (I think, it is a mouthful)
 
If I order an impeller and bellows should I get quicksilver, or are there good cheaper alternatives?
 
Don’t cheap out on the bellows. Make sure it is done right as this is a critical safety issue. Proper adhesive, parts, expansion tool, procedure. I don’t want a leak so I had this done by an experienced shop with a good reputation. After that I took heat from a friend who has done this before and I was told I must be rich. I just don’t want to take water.
 
Sometimes it's OK to get aftermarket - for bellows and impeller, get Mercruiser (Quicksilver is the same thing). FYI, there are 3 bellows - exhaust, driveshaft, shift.
 
You can get a complete set of transom unit tools (bearing puller, bearing installer, bellows tool, hinge pin tool and alignment bar) from e-bay for about $150.

Tools are good to have. I pull my drive units for the winter and garage store them. Only takes 45 minutes using the home made drive stand I fabricated (would be less if I had an electric tongue jack with remote). I check the engine alignment and grease drive shaft every spring before putting drive back on.
 
Bill Curtis said:
You can get a complete set of transom unit tools (bearing puller, bearing installer, bellows tool, hinge pin tool and alignment bar) from e-bay for about $150.

Tools are good to have. I pull my drive units for the winter and garage store them. Only takes 45 minutes using the home made drive stand I fabricated (would be less if I had an electric tongue jack with remote). I check the engine alignment and grease drive shaft every spring before putting drive back on.
Click to expand...

I agree. I will get the tools and refresh the drive. It just seems like the right thing to do. I do not want to take any chances on the old parts. I watched video on this and there are a lot of items to check in there, and easy enough to tear down and refresh.
The gimbal bearing will be a new one for me. I am sure there is lots of support online and the manuals will help for sure.

Also after looking at the cooling system further I concluded my thermostat is stuck open and that the rust is normalish for the age and and way the boat was cared for. I am not worried about the metal flakes yet. I will change some parts due to the age of the boat and get her back in the water.

1st pic you can see what may be preventing the thermostat from closing.

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Ok I found a rather large metal piece that was clearly a rounded edge somewhere... I read on iboats.com this can be looked at as a sign that the manifold is going.
I saw they now make one with molded end caps (no failing gaskets). I look at my engine and it may have had or is currently leaking front and maybe back.
It also may be dripping out of the water circulation pump as there is a lot of rust under that and the thermostat. I take on a small amount of water when I drove it two hours.
I am a little sick about all the rust as I found a large bracket/mount around the power steering pump where wires appear to be grounding (I attached photo) and it seems to have two layers and are separating. I think I will be replacing the manifold, maybe riser if it looks bad. Just buying the gaskets to check this stuff adds up so I am thinking this boat just needs the new parts for security (it is a 97). Now I will be reading more about the closed cooling system.. I think I will put it back together fill it with water and check some other stuff I am learning about.. Boating has a lot more unique facets than I expected haha. I am cool with it though. Thanks again everyone for the input.

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