Replace Open Array with CLosed Array???

The new solid state radars have a much sampler minimum range or “blind spot” where as any magnetron can have a substantial one. That’s what’s so impressive about them, and allows very small objects like crap pot buoys, and even logs floating in the water to be picked up.

Garmin and now Raymarine have solid state radar available in open and closed arrays, but the prices are eye watering! Basically, you have a 18”, or 24” (Garmin)array in the closed arrays, and 36”-72” in the open arrays and can buy the size that make sense for your boat.

The maximum practical range of any of these radars is limited to about 6-10 miles anyway.

I run Quantum 2 and a buddy has Garmin Fantom. Both can separate 2 wave runners easily out to about a 3 mile range. My old 4’ open array couldn’t do that.
I don't really "need" one, but I like my toys... Eventually I want to pick one up. We have a ton of crab pot areas and PVC pipes along the York River heading to the Chesapeake. It'd be nice to see the running at night.
 
Practical range - for location of surface objects 6 to 10 miles, but weather and birds the more the better.
I've had several types of open scanners including Ray Pathfinder analog with the E series displays, Garmin HD series, and now the Garmin Fantom. So, I'm a proponent of the open array units simply for the level of detail returned on the long distance open water boating we do. More times than not I'm glad we could resolve distance as that has allowed us to go around storms and squalls that are all too common off the coast of Fl.
 
Practical range - for location of surface objects 6 to 10 miles, but weather and birds the more the better.
I've had several types of open scanners including Ray Pathfinder analog with the E series displays, Garmin HD series, and now the Garmin Fantom. So, I'm a proponent of the open array units simply for the level of detail returned on the long distance open water boating we do. More times than not I'm glad we could resolve distance as that has allowed us to go around storms and squalls that are all too common off the coast of Fl.

For open water, a larger array is preferred no doubt. I think at the end of the day, there are a lot of very good options when it comes to radar these days, and even at the "low end" you are getting a lot of capabilities and performance. You have to look at your intended use and buy the right piece of equipment. That could be a $1500 Quantum, up to the flagship Open Arrays Solid State units at $10k+.

And now that I've thoroughly hijacked his thread (sorry @icsdoug)...

For the OP, here is a post from the Raymarine Forum that lists out all the compatible scanners for the E120W. Basically everything but the Quantum, and now the Cyclone.

--> https://forum.raymarine.com/showthread.php?tid=4007

And here is a compatible RM RD424 with the cordset for $650. Its a pretty capable Radar.

--> https://maxmarineelectronics.com/pr...log-radar-36-cable-good-cond-90-day-warranty/
 
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I don't really "need" one, but I like my toys... Eventually I want to pick one up. We have a ton of crab pot areas and PVC pipes along the York River heading to the Chesapeake. It'd be nice to see the running at night.

I didn't think I "needed" it either, but its a huge benefit see in my blind spots, and picks up things on the water surface (before I can see them with my naked eye) and at the ranges I operate, its incredibly detailed. I can only imaging what a 4' or 6' Cyclone is capable of! I doubt I'll ever find out given the price!!
 
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I'm a big fan of the Quantum 2 Doppler as it will see objects right at the nose of your boat making it the right tool for the occasion you need up close and personal (I think it can detect objects at 18') I can detect small can buoys that are 12" in diameter maybe 2' high at the entrance to my marina. Big help in the dark.

As has been pointed out, the newer radars require new MFDs, and they isn't cheap. However, a new MFD and radar with a self install is in the $3k-$4k range, especially buying used. 12" Axiom just popped up on here today for $1700. I sold off the working parts of my old system and it paid for about 1/2 of the new stuff, so it can be done rather economically. MaxMarine might even buy some of it.

If your looking for in close navigation, the new domes are great tools, and will out perform your current OA. They will do things that generation of electronics didn't even conceive of. If you venturing far offshore and looking for birds to fish under, the an open array might make sense if you can swing the $6k-$10k.

Just about the only thing I didn’t replace last year was the HD color open array. Although had I replaced it at the time I would have gone with the Quantum. But I understand Ray has just come out with a new radar that I think is an open array (photos and descriptions aren’t that clear.)

I should also point out that getting rid of old electronics can be difficult. I ended up giving away to a friend’s SIL the two E120w displays, high speed switch, DSM and other bits. I tried listing on here and THT and got no interest. So you mileage may vary.
 
Just about the only thing I didn’t replace last year was the HD color open array. Although had I replaced it at the time I would have gone with the Quantum. But I understand Ray has just come out with a new radar that I think is an open array (photos and descriptions aren’t that clear.)

I should also point out that getting rid of old electronics can be difficult. I ended up giving away to a friend’s SIL the two E120w displays, high speed switch, DSM and other bits. I tried listing on here and THT and got no interest. So you mileage may vary.
Yea - I ended up giving away the two working Raymarine 4' arrays. Cost to ship was more than they were worth. Actually, donated them to our local school thrift shop. I understand they had them for a day before someone bought them....
 
So, sent it in to Raymarine for repair, should have just done that in the firt place. Unrepairable, but the are making me a great deal on a remanned Quantum radar with a 2 year warranty. Selling the boat, so I think this is the best solution. Preserves the appearance and it has a upgraded radar! Thanks Guys
 
Guys, I dont care what it looks like. I only need radar for close in imaging, maybe 3 times a year. Anyways, the cost of the adapter plate for the closed array HD Digital is enough to make me just replace it. Its a racket. I can only get estimates for replacing the whole system, no longer supported, you definitely want new, blah, blah blah. Told I had to have new displays. because the buttons were rotted out and Raymarine no longer supports or produces the parts, blah, blah, blah. Got new dials and power buttons at id3gear https://www.i3dgear.com/online-stor...C-and-E-Series-Widescreen-Displays-p133778001 couple of hundred bucks. . So far, saved me about $40k on replacing everything. Just because its a million dollar boat, doesnt mean I have to be stupid.
 
I sent my2002 c120 Mrs and my Friday's to Javier at Sea talk in Miami.
Both led screens were done he replaced w/ new.and I could not be more impressed.
 
Do you all know how to tune the old HD Digital radar array? I just got one of these working with an axiom (Thanks to maxmarine), but the other night it completely missed a 18’ center console that was about 200’ off my bow.
 
This may not be a tuning issue. Depending on your installation, you could have shot over the top of him, or I think more likely it was inside the minimum detection range. That's a function of that radars magnetron technology. I don't think Raymarine publishes a spec that I've seen.

It's a pretty capable radar, but if up close detection is an important consideration, the Quantum would be a much better solution. I think the advertised minimum detection range on the Quantum is about 20', or about the distance from the arch to the bow of a mid sized Dancer.

You can see your minimum detectable range as there will be an empty circle around your boats position on the display. Anything inside that radius would be undetectable.
 
This may not be a tuning issue. Depending on your installation, you could have shot over the top of him, or I think more likely it was inside the minimum detection range. That's a function of that radars magnetron technology. I don't think Raymarine publishes a spec that I've seen.

It's a pretty capable radar, but if up close detection is an important consideration, the Quantum would be a much better solution. I think the advertised minimum detection range on the Quantum is about 20', or about the distance from the arch to the bow of a mid sized Dancer.

You can see your minimum detectable range as there will be an empty circle around your boats position on the display. Anything inside that radius would be undetectable.

200' is not particularly close? My antique of a Raymarine will return buoys up until they're 30-40' from me. I'd think this is more of an installation/adjustment issue than the actual radar's design limits?
 
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200' is not particularly close? My antique of a Raymarine will return buoys up until their 30-40' from me. I'd think this is more of an installation/adjustment issue than the actual radar's design limits?

Could be…One of the setup steps is to go point the boat at a known target right off the bow. You can adjust the bearing to the object (radar may be slightly mis aligned with the boats axis). But you can also get an idea of if the scanner need to be tilted, and how close or far the unit is good for.

I believe that the minimum detectable range is also dependent on the range you have the radar set to. The longer the range, the larger the min detectable range. You may need to zoom into a smaller range to see things closer in. The RL80c Pathfinder had a published minimum range of 25 yards. I would think the HD’s had a similar spec. It should “see” a boat at 200’

One other idea comes to mind…check the Sea Clutter setting. This setting gets rid of noise at water level, but may also impact your close in detection capability.

Next time out paste some pictures of what you are seeing, and a screen shot of the axiom. That could help.
 
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Back to “tuning”, I leave all my adjustments on the Axioms radar page to Auto 95% of the time, and it works very well.
 
Do you all know how to tune the old HD Digital radar array? I just got one of these working with an axiom (Thanks to maxmarine), but the other night it completely missed a 18’ center console that was about 200’ off my bow.
Did you align the scanner relative to your boat's attitude? Shims may be required to resolve close objects.
My scanner (Garmin Fantom 4' open) which is 16 feet above the water will not see objects within around 50 feet. It is set level to the horizon at cruise speed so it points downward a bit when idling.
 
AFAIK, The scanner is the original one. I haven’t touched it. Although it was removed and reinstalled when transported to me.
 

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