AC needed in Puget Sound on a 240DA?

RVPilot

Member
Sep 11, 2020
62
Olympia WA - Puget Sound
Boat Info
1999 270DA
Engines
7.4 Merc MPI B3
Hi Folks ...
I am in the hunt for a 240DA that w will put in the water in Olympia WA. As part of that search we have a punch list of the preferred items that we'd want to have ... example: closed cooling, bottom paint, gas stove, Vacuflush (I know that this is an either-or choice fwith AC)new batteries, shore power, camper canvas ... and AC.

After seeing all of the posts talking about numerous issues with AC units, and since I don't boat in any southern states, should we simply eliminate AC as a preferred item in a prospective 240DA rather than deal with an AC unit that may be more trouble than it's worth for cruising in the PNW?

Any Sea Ray owners in the Puget Sound and San Juans ... please weigh in regarding your experience and opinions on AC for a PNW cruiser.

Thanks in advance ... Tom
 
Keep in mind that AC brings with it heat! If you're looking to maximize the (comfortable) use of your boat I'd consider the AC/Heat a must-have, personally.

You may already know this but without a generator onboard the heat/AC only runs when you're plugged into shore power.
 
Boats of that size do not need AC in the pacific northwest. I would not suggest you make it a required criteria.

I had a 26 (from -ahem- another manufacturer), and a 290. Neither had AC and I never wished for it in many years of PNW cruising. (And please note that my house in Tacoma does have AC so its not like I am against it). What I found with boats that size was that there is quite a bit of cabin wall and floor area that touches the cold (50-55 degrees) water of the Puget Sound, so we get in essence get free cooling.

With the larger boats, the amount (and percentage) of wall area this above the water line increases and the desire for AC increases. I have AC on my 340, and have used it a handful of times.

For the boats in your size, I viewed AC as added weight to carry and added complexity for our area. And in the PNW, its not like AC in that sizes adds significantly to resale value. That may be different in other regions.
 
Last edited:
Sorry for the typo. For boats that size, its not like it adds significantly (I edited to be correct now) to resale value.
Good luck with your search. Good on you for doing your homework.
 
Thanks, the homework is so engaging and fascinating. So, do you think adding 2 extra deeo cycle batteries and an inverter would allow for AC or Heat to be run if needed?
 
I would not worry about AC in the PNW with the size of boat you are looking at.

Heat is a different issue...
The option I liked the best on the 26 and 290 was the red-dot heater that ran off of the engine. Provides heat when you are cruising.
On the 26, there was a grille in the cabin that moved enough heat to be felt in the cockpit.
On the 290, there was a grille in the cabin and two grilles on the cockpit. One of the grilles was at the foot of the helm. It was so great having warm air on your legs while cruising on a cool fall day! It's the feature I most miss with my current boat.

For heat when tied up on a buoy (with the engine off), we used a portable propane Mr Heater like the picture below. Heated the 290's cockpit to 70 degrees on a 40 degree day in low heat mode. And quiet. Like a small fireplace. In fact we used one during our San Juan Islands cruise last week while we played cards and read after dark in the cockpit.

Regarding batteries: Once you get the boat you want, you will want bigger deep cycle batteries for running the refrigerator overnight. But batteries can be changed, so I would not make that a condition of sale.

I would suggest you stay focused on closed cooling, bottom paint, Vacuflush, shore power, and camper canvas. (I deleted the stove since you can change that, and deleted batteries since you can use that to bargain price).
multi-mr-heater-propane-heaters-f232000-e1_1000.jpg
 
tiara in the snow 01.JPG

Reverse cycle AC is really trouble free for the most part. We have never had a failure of any kind in the many years we have been boating. As was pointed out, it also provides heat. We were able to maintain 70+ degrees temperature when it was snowing out. Most modern boats have AC as standard equipment. Don't be put off by the questions about how to fix things that don't work. Following the preventive maintenance routine spelled out in owner manuals keep things working just fine for most people.
 
We have two units on board and if they or not cooling they are heating 24/7. 2 years ago we went into Canada, we were gone 17 days on the boat and the A/C ran 24 hours a day for 17 days. The other feature is auto climate control like in your car, you pick your temp & it will maintain it (heating or cooling).
 
Olympia boater here.

My wife and kids appreciate the AC on our 330DA, but it’s only been used a half-dozen times this summer. I think we’ll all appreciate the heat during fall and winter trips.
 
I'm from Eastern, WA and we don't have A/C on our boat. In the Juan's it cools off pretty quickly as soon as the sun goes down. I've been there when the heat was in the high 90's and even then, it still cooled off fairly fast at night. Over on this side, I've been considering some kind of A/C to put on board and vent through a hatch. It can get miserable at night with lows in the high 60's around 5 to 6 AM. The Heating aspect might be nice, but you'd also need a generator or be plugged in to take advantage of the A/C.
 
Hi Again Tacoma290 and Bill Collector! We're still in Portland, waiting for our engineer and architect to un-covid themselves and start on our foundation in Olympia. As the housing project slowed, so did our boat search ... but it looks like we are making progress on the home, so the boat search is heating up again.

So I am looking for more feedback on cruising the Puget Sound. Will a 240DA or 260DA be a heavy enough boat to handle wind-chop and swells in the Puget Sound between Olympia and Port Townsend and possibly the San Juans? The 240-260 fits our retirement budget, and as a former recreational pilot ... we never flew if the weather wasn't decent. Decent doesn't mean perfect, but we'd never fly if surface winds were over 15-20 mph, and I'm sure reasonable boating has similar limits. So, what does weather look like in the fall and winter months in the Puget Sound?

Are there any statistics on record as to time of year, waves, wind, swells, chop, etc?

Love any advice you can pass on ...
Thanks ... Tom
 
Get as big as you can afford... The bigger the more comfortable you will be.
 
Mark is right. The bigger and heavier, the better off you will be.

Boat Traffic: Your instincts are right that weather is a consideration, but the weight also impacts your ability to deal with other boat traffic. We started with a 26 foot Bayliner (that is way lighter than the Sea Ray 260 you are considering), and we had to get off plane for practically any other boats wake. The boat can take it, but the Admiral did not like it. On busy days in the San Juan Islands that means you are on and off plane every 5 minutes. When we moved up to the 290, we rarely had to get off plane to deal with wakes by using proper attack angles.

Transit to the San Juans: With our 26 foot Bayliner, our first two trips up to the San Juans were via the Swinomish Slough to avoid big water. We liked the town of La Conner, so it worked well. Then we started using Deception Pass. If you plan to go through at or near slack, any reasonable boat can make the crossing.
With the Sea Ray 290, we never went via the Swinomish; we used Deception and then after a few years started heading up via the Strait, given the right weather. Here is how we do it: We can normally make the run from Tacoma to the San Juans without needing fuel, but it is close, so we plan on fuel at Edmonds, which is about half way. Edmonds is our go-no go point. We look at the winds at Smith Island (NOAA station SISW1), and the wave heights at New Dungeness (NOAA Station 40688). If the waves are two feet or less, we go through the Strait. If not, we do Deception. And the key is to leave the your home dock early, before weather sets up in the Strait (the normal pattern is that winds build as the day goes on).

Seasons for Cruising: To answer your question about the seasons, we like the fall and spring. To address weather, we use the app SailFlow to see wind forecasts. If the peak winds are more than 15 it is not worth it. The days are too short in the Winter for long trips, but overnights work just fine. Make sure you have a Mr Heater to keep the cockpit warm when tied up:
4b4be840-77c8-43f0-80e4-467a967b1bfe_2.583f4d923511797ea0fcf745780806f4.jpeg
 
we never flew if the weather wasn't decent.
Tacoma290 had it right on watching the weather. I started out in Puget sound in a 19 foot larson all american. Had to slow for every boat that went by and rarely was comfortable but did several runs through the locks to Port Townsend. Always weather dependent. Next, a Pachanga 270. Went to San Juans from Locks many many times. 2.5 hours but, although I rarely slowed (>40MPH), the passengers more or less couldnt take it. Still, weather dependent. Next was a Rinker 342 Fiesta Vee, Plenty of boat to handle the weather but I didnt like managing the 37 footer in and around docks so went back to my current 270DA. Narrow beam at 8.9 foot and will be somewhat tippy on 2 foot or higher seas but doable. Your 260DA would be similar. Pick the days you go and be smart about checking weather. Some advice when you go - Even with a 260 and a nice day, stay away from west side of Whidbey. That will be uncomfortable in your boat. Go up east side to either deception pass or Swinomish (my preferred). Keep aware that Swinomish Channel has mudflat/shallow water particularly at low tide so STAY IN the channels and go slow as debris in water is not uncommon there. If you go deception, try to go with tides even though a 260 should be fine either way. Be prepared when you exit the north end, it can surprise you how rough it can be when east whidbey is calm. Its only for a few miles to get in the islands but still need to be aware. If you go Swinomish (again my preferred), be aware of tide flow up to 7 knots depending on tide range. Also, when you exit north and come around south end of Guemes, same as deception, can be rougher than expected. Again, only for a short time til your in the islands that protect from west/southwest winds. And, yes, its a good idea to fuel in Edmonds checking weather as Admiralty inlet can also be a surprise. You'll know heading north past Edmonds as thats where the weather/Seas change. Also, in a smaller boat like your considering, have a decent GPS/Chartplotter/radar. Weather can sock in at San Juans often between July and September and the last thing you need is to be center channel going up or back and no indication where you are. Its best to stay put until weather clears of course but, having the electronics is a safety redundancy to 1) staying put. In the San Juans and Pugest Sound, seems weather all ways blows more between about 1400 and 1800 - So, given a smallish cruiser, I always try to be at Port by 1500ish.

Now the other redundancy -If you can swing it, get twin engine set up (even though I only have the single on my 270 but I have years of experience now). Why, redundancy. If an engine dies you still have one to work against the tide. A dinghy on a 260 wont have enough umph to move you in any kind of wind or tides/but have the dinghy too (redundancy just like on your plane, right?). THis is less a concern if you stay south around Olympia/Tacoma. North of Seattle its the real deal. Make sure your windlass works and make sure you practice how to effectively and comfortably anchor. Get Vessel Assist set up. There is a facility in Everett and then another at Deception pass (or used to be) so if all fails, you can anchor and call Vessel Assist (be prepared for up to 2 hour til they get to you). Good radio system with MMSI as well. Make sure all mechanicals are in top shape. Travel the first few times with friends who know the way if you can.

So, given you manage safety/watch for weather, arent in a hurry, and have redundant features, a 260 will work. I have been doing it for years and will continue to do so in my new to me 270DA. Having the smaller size makes it super nice in tight spaces where all the bigger boats have taken all the good spots at Roche or Friday and your late and need to squeeze in those less than favorable spots. And, its only the admiral and I so its plenty of room for two. I am unusual to some on the forum here because I went big(ish) and have gone back to manageable to me 30 foot overall. I trailer it as well. thats a whole nuther ball game of redundancy and safety.
 
Thanks so much Guys!! Although cruising to the San Juans is likely 2-3 years away, this is HUGELY helpful! In the near term, we'll be looking to explore from Olympia to as far north as Port Townsend to develop our confidence and sea legs ... and are hoping for a lot of 2-3 day "out and back" overnights.

So a few follow up questions please ...
1. are there any weather reporting stations in the Puget Sound from north of Seattle south to Olympia that you like to monitor? (THANKS so much for those 2 NOAA reporting stations)
2. I appreciate the "over 15kt winds is too much" perspective. Can you opine .. along with the wind, at what level of wave-swell heights convince you to stay in your marina? (in the Puget Sound, this is mostly wind driven, correct?)
3. In smaller boats down here on the Columbia out of Portland, we also look at Sailflow. Are there other apps that you like?
4. Do either of you know anyone in the Tacoma-Oly area who has a 240 or 260 Sundancer? If so, we would love to connect with them and pick their brains.
5. And finally, does the Propane Buddy generate any co2? Are you Ok to use it below decks?

Thank again so much ...
Best, Tom
 
5. And finally, does the Propane Buddy generate any co2? Are you Ok to use it below decks?

Hi Tom, Buddy Heater produces CO, we produce CO2 when we exhale. I own 2 HB's one on the boat and the other in our motorhome. They will shut down in a low oxygen environment. I have never experienced this as we always have a window cracked or a vent open.
 

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