Generator or No Generator

Usually they mount it safely on the transom!

It does kind of make me wonder, though, how much extra engineering it would take to make a Honda EU series generator ignition-protected. I've seen those things running before at events and they are dead silent unless you're within about 5 feet of them. The other thought I had is what if they were in a sealed enclosure with their own forced air ventilation?

Obviously this glosses over ideas about fuel supply, electrical connectivity, cooling and exhaust elimination.

But for some reason those Honda EU generators feel like space age technology relative to your bog standard Kohler generators, especially since they output pure sine wave AC and are so quiet. I can't even find any Kohler marine generator sound ratings, but Honda's numbers shows even their entire model line under 70 db(A), with the 10kw unit just slightly over at 73.
I love those Honda’s also. I use the smaller 2000’s for work.
I’m no engineer, but I think the problem would be more than ignition protection. The exhaust on a dry exhaust engine runs very hot while, in comparison, wet exhaust runs a lot cooler. The exhaust manifold with standard gas engine could flash off some gas fumes just by the heat of the manifold inside an engine room. I don’t think a water cooled exhaust could do that.
So I guess Honda could enter the market for Marine generators and would likely take a lot of business.
Some marine technician please correct me if I am wrong. I am curious also.
 
I love those Honda’s also. I use the smaller 2000’s for work.
I’m no engineer, but I think the problem would be more than ignition protection. The exhaust on a dry exhaust engine runs very hot while, in comparison, wet exhaust runs a lot cooler. The exhaust manifold with standard gas engine could flash off some gas fumes just by the heat of the manifold inside an engine room. I don’t think a water cooled exhaust could do that.
So I guess Honda could enter the market for Marine generators and would likely take a lot of business.
Some marine technician please correct me if I am wrong. I am curious also.

I guess my cave man engineering concept is a sealed "generator cabinet" inside the engine room which a generator like this would go. It would have its own forced air blower pulling in fresh air from outside the boat at a rate 20% over exhaust output at maximum rpms, which by my back-of-the envelope math is about 15 cfm (for the 296 cc 3k model).

Placing it in its own cabinet sealed from the actual engine room would eliminate gas fume contamination from the main engine room and its own blower/air supply keeps its compartment from gas fume contamination and overheating.

The only thing I can't naively oversimplify is getting fuel from the main fuel tanks, as these generators probably use a gravity feed from their internal tanks.

IMHO, the big advantage of using a "drop in" portable generator on small recreational craft would be the cost and ease of maintenance, since the entire generator could be pulled out. A 7 kW Honda inverter generator only weighs 260 pounds and has an MSRP of $4900. A Westerbeke 5 kW is $12,000. I'm not sure how a wet exhaust, heat exchanger and fuel pump add $7,000 in cost, especially when you're giving up pure sine wave AC output.
 
Just make sure you strap it down real good. :)
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The 2000 270 we looked at (9'2" beam) had a 7.4 with a brand new genny. Apparently they couldn't get the old genny working so the previous owner had a brand new one installed. I think it had 8 hours on it. I really wanted that boat but it needed alot of work
 
As fussy as my Westerebeke can make me at times and as many times as I want to use it as a anchor

I LOVE the damn thing! Fridge stays cold, batteries stay topped off. Hot coffee in the morning while on the hook
 
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I guess my cave man engineering concept is a sealed "generator cabinet" inside the engine room which a generator like this would go. It would have its own forced air blower pulling in fresh air from outside the boat at a rate 20% over exhaust output at maximum rpms, which by my back-of-the envelope math is about 15 cfm (for the 296 cc 3k model).

Placing it in its own cabinet sealed from the actual engine room would eliminate gas fume contamination from the main engine room and its own blower/air supply keeps its compartment from gas fume contamination and overheating.

The only thing I can't naively oversimplify is getting fuel from the main fuel tanks, as these generators probably use a gravity feed from their internal tanks.

IMHO, the big advantage of using a "drop in" portable generator on small recreational craft would be the cost and ease of maintenance, since the entire generator could be pulled out. A 7 kW Honda inverter generator only weighs 260 pounds and has an MSRP of $4900. A Westerbeke 5 kW is $12,000. I'm not sure how a wet exhaust, heat exchanger and fuel pump add $7,000 in cost, especially when you're giving up pure sine wave AC output.
You may want to read the manual on one of these sweet little Honda gennys. Pages 7-9 discuss the importance of running them with a minimum of 3' clearance around any structure. Also stresses the importance of not placing them in any kind of enclosure. Honda mentions these points to avoid causing them to catch things around them on fire, such as sound shields, genny enclosures, engine rooms, etc. Nice genny, just the wrong one for a boat. If it was easy, everyone would be doing it.
 
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You may want to ready the manual on one of these sweet little Honda gennys. Pages 7-9 discuss the importance of running them with a minimum of 3' clearance around any structure. Also stresses the importance of not placing them in any kind of enclosure. Honda mentions these points to avoid causing them to catch things around them on fire, such as sound shields, genny enclosures, engine rooms, etc. Nice genny, just the wrong one for a boat. If it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

Like I said, cave man engineering.
 
A friend of mine went to sell his 34' Sundancer a number of years ago - Didn't have a Generator...

He got very tired of all the interested parties calling to say "the ad says no generator - is that a misprint?"

The story ends with him eventually selling the boat at a HUGE discount since almost every potential buyer said they'd be interested only IF it had a generator! Oops.
 
Like many others - have had it both ways. Certainly will not go without again. Opens up so many options that are not available without. So far as maintenance . . . you take care of it and it will take care of you. Very little time and expense to maintain. Most important is to use it, don't let it sit.
 
It is nice to have. I don't sleep with it running. I run it more to keep it in good shape. It is a nice feature - but an expensive one. Could I live without it. Yes. For resale - it would be tough to sell in my area without one.
 
IMHO, the big advantage of using a "drop in" portable generator on small recreational craft would be the cost and ease of maintenance, since the entire generator could be pulled out. A 7 kW Honda inverter generator only weighs 260 pounds and has an MSRP of $4900. A Westerbeke 5 kW is $12,000. I'm not sure how a wet exhaust, heat exchanger and fuel pump add $7,000 in cost, especially when you're giving up pure sine wave AC output.

and now you understand why people put a $700 honda on the swim platform. And if it falls off, buy another one.
 
By the time ABYC and NMMA approved the modifications for an air cooled generator for use on a boat we would probably end up with something like this: A gasoline engine that pulls fuel from the main boat tank to prevent storing and venting fumes in the same vicinity as the engine. A constant source of cooling water for the super hot exhaust to keep the exhaust manifold less than 100 degrees to prevent flashing any possible fumes. Exhaust running outside the boat in a sealed tube to prevent CO contamination. A special carburetor with no outside drain for a stuck float or fuel injection with malfunction safeties. Ignition protection screens on all electrical generation, transfer, and connection points. Heavy duty, vibration dampening mounts to prevent shifting in heavy seas but still not transferring running noise to the hull.
Sounds like sometime a long time ago, some really smart people got together and modified an air cooled, portable generator to make it safe for a boat!!!
 
By the time ABYC and NMMA approved the modifications for an air cooled generator for use on a boat we would probably end up with something like this: A gasoline engine that pulls fuel from the main boat tank to prevent storing and venting fumes in the same vicinity as the engine. A constant source of cooling water for the super hot exhaust to keep the exhaust manifold less than 100 degrees to prevent flashing any possible fumes. Exhaust running outside the boat in a sealed tube to prevent CO contamination. A special carburetor with no outside drain for a stuck float or fuel injection with malfunction safeties. Ignition protection screens on all electrical generation, transfer, and connection points. Heavy duty, vibration dampening mounts to prevent shifting in heavy seas but still not transferring running noise to the hull.
Sounds like sometime a long time ago, some really smart people got together and modified an air cooled, portable generator to make it safe for a boat!!!

Now I know why I can't have nice/cheap things.

Once spring arrives, I will run my Kohler even more, if only to appreciate the beauty of its engineering. Perhaps I will even by a 120v submersible fountain pump to share my joy while at anchor.
 
Let's get ourselves on Shark Tank!!!!

What follows is for the purposes of winter season discussion only. :)

What would be the implications of designing some kind of floating platform for an air cooled, off the shelf generator that would be tethered to the boat? As has been outlined within this very thread you can buy yourself a dinghy and a decent non-marine generator for much less than the cost of a Westerbeke.

Soo....for fun. Floating generators anyone?

Pros:
Cost
Cost

Cons:
Is proper grounding achievable, deal breaker?
A 30A tether floating in the water would be challenging?
You'd have to store it on the swim platform while driving the boat
What other bad news comes with this?
 
I would say NO generator... I have had two on my current boat, and now I am going for a third... Total cost of over $20K in repairs and maintenance. If you don't use them, they will break... If you winterize them incorrectly, you will have to buy an new one.. I would have a lot more money if I did not have a generator... I don't need one, so I don't use it enough... Only enough to break them...
 
Let's get ourselves on Shark Tank!!!!

What follows is for the purposes of winter season discussion only. :)

What would be the implications of designing some kind of floating platform for an air cooled, off the shelf generator that would be tethered to the boat? As has been outlined within this very thread you can buy yourself a dinghy and a decent non-marine generator for much less than the cost of a Westerbeke.

Soo....for fun. Floating generators anyone?

Pros:
Cost
Cost

Cons:
Is proper grounding achievable, deal breaker?
A 30A tether floating in the water would be challenging?
You'd have to store it on the swim platform while driving the boat
What other bad news comes with this?

Let's say we agree with the basic sanity of this, I mean we use shore power, which means the connection between the boat and the power source goes over the water in some way. And the "power source" may actually be on a floating dock, so it gets "even more realistic".

IMHO to make this work, you have to have a "power dinghy" that's self-righting, self-bailing and keeps the generator upright. Probably also needs to be highly splash resistant and rain resistant. My guess is whatever shape and mass this has is really awkward to carry around with you. Of course it has to be highly heat resistant, maybe some kind of stainless steel lining with high temperature insulation behind it.

I'm less worried about the power cord, I guess I would design some kind of combination tether/power cord that would be used to tie it off to the boat while at the same time preventing any potential stress on the actual power conductors, even when pulled taught.

It's almost less crazy than my concept of an enclosed air-cooled generator box, although I think the idea of it being sealed from the engine compartment and forced ventilated didn't get enough fair hearing...
 
Just for the sake of argument aren't home based gensets weather resistant?

My biggest con to the idea would be people are just plane lazy. They are not going to spend the time or money of any float system for a genset when they think it's just fine to throw it on the swim platform and go.
 
Just for the sake of argument aren't home based gensets weather resistant?

My biggest con to the idea would be people are just plane lazy. They are not going to spend the time or money of any float system for a genset when they think it's just fine to throw it on the swim platform and go.

I mean a permanently installed one is, but I don't think the Honda portable ones are really meant to be run in the pouring rain.
 

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