isinglass vs. strataglass for rolling....(long post)

CliffA

Well-Known Member
Dec 29, 2009
4,712
Lake Norman, NC
Boat Info
2001 Sea Ray 340DA
Name: 'Happy Place'
4.5kW West. Generator
Purchased Nov. 2014
Fresh Water Use
Engines
Twin Merc. 6.2L (MPI)
640 hp (Total)
Raw Water Cooled
V-Drive Transmissions
i had strataglass windows installed when i had new camper canvas made a few years ago.....it is more expensive than isinglass but the canvas maker convinced me i would like the strataglass better than the isinglass....i am starting to think his reasoning was more about the extra money for him and not really about which product would work best for me....:(......

my experience with strataglass so far has not been what i expected.....

i had the new canvas designed with straps on each window so that i could roll them up when needed during the transition periods from cool to warm weather when it is cold at night but warm during the day.....when i roll up the windows they get very wrinkled and wavy which is unsightly when i roll them back down...the wrinkles never really fall out completely even when the windows are exposed to direct sunlight for a while....also the first couple of years i stored the windows in the summer by rolling them up with bed sheets in between each one....when i installed them the next fall the windows are even more wrinkled and wavy.....now i hang them flat on the wall of my garage during summer storage which helps some...

also i have to question the claimed 'scratch resistant' coating on the strataglass....in my experience the windows will scratch very easily in spite of this coating....especially the door panel in the canvas....sometimes on a warm day instead of rolling the door up so not to cause additional wrinkles i will leave the door hanging but not zipped to the side panels...when someone enters or leaves the cockpit they just push the door panel aside which causes them to lightly brush against the door panel....this has caused a lot of small scratches in the door panel....

most of my dock friend's boats have isinglass panels...they seem to be much more forgiving as far as not holding wrinkles when rolled up and not scratching as easily....

the reason for this post is to ask if anyone has had the same experience and to also ask if isinglass would be a better product for camper windows if the windows are expected to be rolled up from time to time.....if the windows were never to be rolled up or taken down for summer storage i would see the appeal of strataglass over isinglass due to the claimed better clarity of the strataglass....it is to the point i am seriously considering replacing the wrinkled and scratched strataglass panels with isinglass.....i have tried to use a heat gun on the wrinkles...this helps some but is very time consuming and needs to be repeated each time the panels are rolled up....

thanks for taking the time to read this long post....:)....

cliff
 
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Isinglass is a generic term for clear vinyl.

Strataglass is a brand name.

There are basically two kinds of Isenglass:

1- Rolled (extruded) ....less expensive.

2- Pressed and polished sheets (like Strataglass and O'Sea, etc.)......more expensive.

My experience is, the higher priced "pressed" sheets have better clarity "out of the box" and maintain clarity longer.

I will say the scratch resistant coatings added to Strataglass and some other higher end pressed clears are not that great in my opinion.

If you get in the habit of making a good "roll" with you clears you can avoid some of the wrinkling. Storing flat is always best but not that practical.

I lean toward rolled 40g as it is good bang for the buck.
 
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Cliff, as I was reading your post, I was tempted to glance at the member info to see if I wrote it.

I think Strata is scamming us, and I've been saying this for years. Not only in my does Strata scratch easily, but they insist on products like Imar that are expensive and not very effective at hiding those scratches.

A brief re-tell: I opted-out of Strata on the installation before this current one. I bought Plexus by the case (literally) and used it on my car headlights, motorcycle visor, and weekly on the isen. By the time the Sunbrella had become fragile and was shredded by a hailstorm, the isen still looked new. It had tons of scratches by then, but a fresh application of Plexus hid them very effectively.

When I spec'd the replacement isen/canvas, I told the shop owner that I'm satisfied with the regular isen and again would opt-out of the Strata upgrade. He said, "oh, I buy Strata in bulk and was having a hard time stocking both, so last time I installed Strata for you without an up-charge."

So I had Strata the whole time, and used forbidden Plexus the whole time. Maybe it's overall better than comparable isen, but I call BS on their "special coating" and Imar requirement.
 
Not to hijack, but what's the thicker (almost solid) windows one can get? Thinking windshield that gets out up in the beginning of the season and doesn't get taken down until the end of the season.
 
IMG_3636.JPG
We have isenglass and find that it works very well. Our drop curtain is 14 years old and still looks brand new. It spends most of its time rolled up in a locker down below, but can be up for days at a time when we cruise. I use Plexus on it to clean it up occasionally and that's about it. Our eisenglass is thicker than most that I have seen but that is probably due to Tiara. The company tends to use higher quality components in its build process than most other production manufacturers. Here is a pic of the clarity I shot recently on an overnight spent on the hook.
 
We have strata, had isen before. I like the clarity of strata. However we don't use them much and have the luxury of storing them flat. Taking care when rolling to keep the roll straight and without wrinkles is key for either product, IMO. Keeping them rolled up for more than a few hours in our Florida sun is something we avoid.
 
For clients that like to roll up their eisenglass and/or regularly take down and store rolled I have been recommending 40g rolled for the front visors (slightly better) and 30g rolled for the sides. Factory from Great Lakes is 30g rolled for almost all.

If this is more or less a permanent enclosure than other factors may come into play when determining suitability.

-Kevin
 
thanks for the replies....shame on me for not taking more time to learn about the different types of windows before having the canvas made and shame on the canvas guy for not taking the time to ask how we intend to use the canvas and guiding us to use the best product for the windows based on that usage.....

i guess this is another one of those 'life lessons' learned the hard way....man i hope those are just about over with since they can get to be very expensive.....:(.....

cliff
 
Strataglass is a great product with awesome clarity.....i just think the extra $ for the scratch resistant coating is questionable. By the way, Crystal/Clear 2020 is the less expensive, "uncoated" version of Strataglass.
 

I've got EZ2CY on my front 3. They've developed some light surface swirls from cleaning that annoy me when the sun hits them right. so far haven't been able to figure out a solution to hide, lessen these. Maybe Plexus? I haven't tried that. I also heard brass cleaner can help, but that might be more for vinyl.
 
EZ2CY again is NOT a material, it is a manufacturer that uses a brand of acrylic. Just like isinglass is NOT a brand. Acrylic is the material and the best brand is made by Piedmont and is called PMG Aquaglass. Acrylic sheet are the panels used panels that are rarely, if ever, removed. They do not roll up and are meant to be semi-permanent. Please read Quint's reply above. Isinglass is not a brand, or for that matter even a material. It is a very generic term used to describe clear vinyl material. There are many manufacturers of this material, and within those, each makes a different grade of material along with different thicknesses. In my 20 years as a marine fabricator, Strataglass and O'Sea make the best material out there, when specified and used properly. It is the responsibility of the fabricator to help the boat owner make informed decisions on using the correct material for the application. Clarity, coatings, and thickness are determining factors in the selection of material. Materials with a surface coating, O'Sea and Strataglass, do RESIST scratches, but they are not scratch proof. A protectant on the surface will add another step of protection. I recommend to all of my customers to use a coat of paste wax, once a year. This helps rejuvinate the oils in the material that UV rays break down. It also is a thin protective layer preventing scratches and will in most cases buff out the light small scratches causes by daily use. Plexus is a great cleaner and protectant for all clear vinyl, however it is expensive. Additionally, the method which the material is rolled makes a huge difference. Carefully roll the material in as loose a roll as possible when rolling up U zip windows, or removing the panels during the hotter part of the day. The best method for storing when not in use is to lay flat, but we often don't have that kind of space available on our boats. It is also critical during the fabrication process to let new material "relax" prior to cutting and fabricating the panels. I try to unroll all clear vinyls for two days in a 65 degree shop and let them relax from being tightly rolled prior to any patterning. If the fabricator doesn't do this, the material will retain a memory of the roll and it will show after the panel is fabricated.
 
What Quint4 said in the 2nd post is just about what I have experienced.
I've had "isinglass" on previous boats that wrinkled and eventually scratched.
My current boat had original 40g smoke strataglass when we bought it that I changed last winter because one panel was damaged in a storm through my fault and I had to replace a panel when we were looping that cracked when I tried to roll it up on a very cool (cold)morning.
The glass was almost perfect otherwise.
As I said, last winter, I took my complete bridge enclosure to Gioia Sails (original vendor to Sea Ray for my canvas) in NJ for glass replacement. They told me they no longer were using Strataglass, and that if I wanted the protective coating it would be O'Sea, but they actually told me that the protective coating isn't all that protective on stata or O'Sea, but is somewhat better than not. I opted for the O'sea 40g and so far so good (but it is virtually brand new). I no longer roll my front glass, I installed snaps on the bimini ceiling and snap them up. I have always rolled felt sheets cut to fit, in the side glass. I like the 40g, which I have had now on my last 2 boats, and jury is out on the coating, I went for it on the new glass because my previous and this boat had strataglass that was in great shape, but that may have been more due to the heavier glass that was handled, rolled and stored very carefully.
 
Plexus is a great cleaner and protectant for all clear vinyl, however it is expensive.

I agree that it works great. It's one of my favorite products, but note that Strataglass states on its website that using Plexus will void their warranty.
 
We are in a location that tests both additives on Strataglass to the max. May northern boaters only mention the anti- scratch coating because that is what is important toy you. Down here in Sunny Florida, the UV coatings are more important.

I use 40 ga. Strataglass on the front and sides of my enclosure and 30 ga. on the aft panels. The reason is to reduce the weight suspended off the back of my radar arch. I clean it with Imar cleanser when we put the boat up after a trip or a week in Florida and we wax/polish it with Imar wax 3 times a year. I am getting 7-8 years in the FL sun this way.

And here is the real difference......Strataglass lasts about 3X as long as vinyl sheet goods in this environment. I had the transom door panel damaged by an oyster thrown thru it by a weedeater. The canvas shop was out of 30ga Strataglass so he replaced the panel with vinyl so we could close up the boat. It lasted between 2 and 3 years before it becan to yellow and get brittle aroung the edges....and it had the same cleaners and treatment that the Strataglass in the next panel had......and they are 9 years old.
 
I'm replacing the front and sides this winter. I was going to try 30 mil O'Sea. According to Sailrite, if you roll them, the 30 works better than the 40, especially up north when it gets colder.

I have a sewing machine, so I'm just going to sew in a few new pieces and see how it works.
 
We had a Strataglass/Sunbrella camperback enclosure fabricated 4 years ago. We also replaced the forward clear sections with Strataglass at the same time. For the first season, I used the Imar spray product to clean them. After that, I've been using Shurhold serious shine spray with microfiber cloths, because I tend to use that on almost everything around the boat as a detailing spray, so I don't have to keep yet another product onboard. It seems to keep them crystal clear. The forward sections mostly stay in place all summer except the center panel above the windshield which is rolled up a lot. That one has a couple scratches where the two straps contact the glass to be rolled up. Probably due to surface dirt that was on the outside of the glass before it was rolled up, and it acted like an abrasive when the boat is underway rubbing against the straps.

The aft enclosure is rolled up and left on sometimes, but is also often removed, rolled up, and put below. I have found that having an ample Sunbrella "frame" around the panels lightens them, which is nice, it also provides a canvas cover around the rolled up Strataglass, so even without a real cover, when I put the rolls down below, there isn't any exposed clear that can get scratched by someone inadvertently. So many enclosures I see are almost all clear, with little canvas. I think that's great for visibility, but we almost never run with the rear enclosure down, it's just when we're anchored or in the marina on a cold or buggy night. It's really a preference thing I suppose.

Each offseason, I have our canvas guy remove all the canvas and glass, clean and polish it, treat all the zippers and snaps, and hang it unrolled in a sail loft all winter. It literally goes on the boat looking like new every spring. It costs more than leaving it on the boat all winter, but I feel like it cost me an arm and a leg to have it custom made, and I don't want to do that again any time soon ;)
 
My canvas guy advised against Strata since we roll up. We only use the camper enclosure 4 months each year so the clarity is not that big of an issue.
 

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