410 Sundancer/Express Cruiser and 400 Sundancer/Express Cruiser **Official Thread**

Boulz said:
Your swim ladder was made by GG Schmidt, original pn is L08E3103. It is no longer made but they have a replacement L08E3105-RP1.

Brace yourself as it is expensive. However if you are the original owner of the boat they will replace it for free.

Contact Jessica Martin at jmartin@ggschmidt.com or 717-394-3701. I just got one from her for my 97 400 DA.

John
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Received the ladder this week and installed. Perfect fit, once I figured out how those damn little tabs should be aligned.

I was able to replace just the 3 step section (the part that is at the bottom of the lake). Full ladder through Sea Ray $650. 3 step section through Sea Ray ~$500. 3 step section direct from the OEM $333 delivered. Order time to delivery was about 10 days total. Perfect fit, full original quality. Not happy about dropping $300 overboard, but happy with the final product.

If I remember to, I'll find and post the coordinates of the old ladder section. Maybe an adventurous diver will be interested in finding it and reselling it. Only about 25 FOW on a hard clay bottom, but the fuel for me to get down and back will almost be the same as the cost to replace the ladder, which is why I didn't do it myself.
 
Boulz said:
Anyone with a 1997 400 DA put SeaDek on the upper and lower swim platform? Looking for someone who may have a template or worked with a source that made one up that can do the same for me. Thanks!
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Did mine helm to platform. Did you call seadek? They should have my patterns. Have them send it to you and check the fit. If that doesn't work, PM me
 
Boulz said:
Anyone with a 1997 400 DA put SeaDek on the upper and lower swim platform? Looking for someone who may have a template or worked with a source that made one up that can do the same for me. Thanks!
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I'm curious how this will turn out for you. In my opinion the cost associated with Sea Deck is money well spent if you don't have to do much more than confirm that their template fits and then install the material once received. If you have to actually create your own template I'd suggest you go with the cheapo Ebay EVA foam. 99.987% of the work associated with installing EVA foam is in the creation of the template. If you have to endure the shear pain of this process you might as well save $500+.

Here's the Ebay stuff on my 97 400DA. I'd make some changes if I did it again but man...I really hope to never have to do that again...

I'd offer you my templates for free if I didn't already burn them in a fit of rage and back pain after completing this project.

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You should make your own template from heavy plastic for your own boat.
It will take a little while to do, but if you have a helper and pre-cut your plastic pretty close based on measurements off the boat, and then make final marks/cuts in place, it goes pretty smoothly.
I ordered Aquamat from Corinthian for my cockpit and they used a template they had for the 410. It was a total of 3 pieces. As it turned out the hole for the cockpit table was off by an inch or so. They were great about it and had me make a template for a replacement piece which they got to me really quickly at no cost to me.
BTW: Great company and a fantastic product.
But besides the piece that they replaced, had I been making my own templates from the beginning, I probably would have done the other two pieces a little differently too.
 
I don't understand what the difficulty in making the template is. You order the Mylar for twenty dollars or so from seadeck(refundable on purchase). Tape it to your deck. Trace your nonskid line with the provided marker. Then mail it to them. They trace it with a CAD program and send you a full size set of computer generated Mylar templates complete with teak lines. You approve it or make adjustments.
 
Riptide III said:
I don't understand what the difficulty in making the template is. You order the Mylar for twenty dollars or so from seadeck(refundable on purchase). Tape it to your deck. Trace your nonskid line with the provided marker. Then mail it to them. They trace it with a CAD program and send you a full size set of computer generated Mylar templates complete with teak lines. You approve it or make adjustments.
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Perhaps with SeaDek it's a bit easier (or a lot). If you're doing the DIY route you have to go around every feature on the platform (ladder, davits, motor holders, vents) and ensure the lines are straight and even top to bottom and around every cutout. For us it was not as easy as tracing the nonskid. It involved a lot of measuring and adjusting.

I don't recall exactly at this point but I think we had 6 hours or more just in making templates for my upper and lower platforms. Painful. Clearly your mileage may vary. And I would not do it again.
 
When I ordered my stuff and they told me they had a template for my boat I was thrilled thinking that I would be saving that step.
My heart really sunk when I installed it and saw that the biggest piece, over the engine hatch, wasn’t useable because the hole for the table base was off.
Luckily, they were great about it since it was their template and they told me to make a template and send it to them. That was a relief.
I think that all I needed to make the template was a roll of 6 mil plastic from Home Depot, a pair of scissors, masking tape, straight edge, sharpie, and a round paper plate the same size of the diameter I needed the cutout for the cockpit table to be so I could get a perfect circle.
I only had to make it for the piece that covers the engine hatch (the other pieces they sent me that were made from their template were okay).
I took a generous measurement of roughly the size I needed the plastic to be and cut that off the boat to make it easier to work with.
Then, with the help of my wife, I stretched and taped it to the deck, used the straight edge to mark nice clean lines around the perimeter, the paper plate to mark a perfect circle for the table base, took it off the boat and made my cuts.
Then I taped it back in place to double check my work and marked top/bottom - port/stbd - fwd/aft on the plastic. Once satisfied, I installed the adjoining piece and used the straight edge to line up where I wanted the faux teak lines.
I think the whole process took about half an hour.
They sent me the replacement piece really quickly. Once I got it and compared it to the other pieces I started wishing I had made all my own templates from scratch because it looked so much better than the others.
Lesson learned: put in the extra work and make your own template because there could be subtle differences from one boat to another, or the person who made the template the factory has may not have made it the way you would have made it.
 
Ben1553 said:
I've read that you have to remove the fridge cabinet to fit a new fridge through the companionway door...is this the case with vitrofrigo AND norcold....or just vitrofrigo?
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Ben

It depends on which vitrifrigo you want to use . I an replacing mine now as we speak . Not Her Decision is helping greatly as he has experience in this field . He's replaced every part on a 460 that can be replaced .
We have the cabinet gutted and will have to remove the companionway doors ( big Pain ) . Rebuild these doors when it's apart . Planning on using a Vitrifrigo
Vitrifrigo DP2600iXD4-F-1 S/S Double Door 08.1 cf 52.9375" H 23.4375" W 23.6875" D


Will advise how it works out .
Thanks
 
Welcome Jackpot and thanks for the call out! You will have that boat in Bristol condition in no time!

Josh
 
Riptide III said:
I don't understand what the difficulty in making the template is. You order the Mylar for twenty dollars or so from seadeck(refundable on purchase). Tape it to your deck. Trace your nonskid line with the provided marker. Then mail it to them. They trace it with a CAD program and send you a full size set of computer generated Mylar templates complete with teak lines. You approve it or make adjustments.
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Yes! I ordered the template from SeaDek so once I arrives I will follow the process you outlined. Even if I went another route, getting their full size template is worth the $20. The question I will have to figure out is how to handle my Hurley Original Davit that has four mounting blocks bolted to the platform. I am figuring I will have to put a spacer the thickness of the SeaDek under each block and cut out the shape/location of each block in the SeaDek. Will keep everyone posted. Thanks for the ideas and feedback.
 
Just went to the Norwalk Boat Show and spoke with the Sea Ray folks. Does everyone know Sea Ray won't be making large boats any longer? I think their largest will be 34'. Also Brunswick decided not to spin off Sea Ray. So 2018 will be the last model year for the 400 Sundancer. The local MarineMax dealer has a new 2018 leftover in Norwalk with a sticker of $877K he is willing to let go for $500K. I was tempted....
 
Boulz said:
Just went to the Norwalk Boat Show and spoke with the Sea Ray folks. Does everyone know Sea Ray won't be making large boats any longer? I think their largest will be 34'. Also Brunswick decided not to spin off Sea Ray. So 2018 will be the last model year for the 400 Sundancer. The local MarineMax dealer has a new 2018 leftover in Norwalk with a sticker of $877K he is willing to let go for $500K. I was tempted....
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There are threads and discussion on this site dedicated to this topic, and lots of speculation about the rationale and the impact.

I think the discussion is largely spent....
 
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Boulz said:
Anyone with a 1997 400 DA put SeaDek on the upper and lower swim platform? Looking for someone who may have a template or worked with a source that made one up that can do the same for me. Thanks!
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I did it last year. I actually did have SeaDek send me Riptide’s dry-fit templates and they were REALLY close. But I had to make a few adjustments and, if we’re being honest, ran out of time to do it myself. So I paid a company named SC Wake to come finish the templates and install it. They did a phenomenal job! I can’t recommend the company or the product enough.

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carterchapman said:
Z - that looks great - I really like your upholstery inserts as well...
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Thanks!! We’ve put a lot of time and energy into updating things, and we think it turned out pretty good. The colors are a better match in real life; the photo makes them look further off.

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JVM225 said:
410 Sundancer with 3126 Caterpillar owners:
What diameter/pitch props are you running and why?
After hearing some stories about lost valuable boating time waiting for a prop after a mid season mishap I’m thinking about picking up a spare set to get me quickly back on the water if it ever happens to me.
My boat has Hy Torq Nibral 22 x 21.5 cupped props on it. Not sure if they are original, or what Sea Ray originally put on the boat.
The boat runs well with them.
But since I’m thinking of picking up another set over the winter I figured I’d see what others had and why.
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I'm running 22"x23" (what is stamped on the hubs). During the sea trial, I was told I get 2700 RPM at WOT, so slightly over propped. I'm going to get better tach's going first and take a look at this as a winter project. I usually run full fuel, 1/2-full water and 6 people. I would think 22"x21.5" would be ideal.
 
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Question for the late 90's 400 guys out there:

How the heck do you get to the front end of the generator? I thought the ER on the 400 was an absolute dream until my generator stopped producing AC power (I believe/hope it to be the capacitor). Is there some vodoo trick to get into this area or is it as obscene as it looks?

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I have that vintage of a 400, but it's diesel and an Express, so the bilge layout is a little different. But the short answer is yes, it's as obscene as it looks. It's sinful as to how difficult it is for me to change my generator impeller. I doubt you're missing anything - they just weren't too concerned with access for maintenance. The best advice I can give is to jump in there and start moving stuff out of your way - it might not quite as bad as it looks.
 
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