Please delete

PlayDate said:
Classic Troll behavior: Argue, insult, bait and name calling.....repeat. I don't know what pleasure people get from it but they apparently do since it shows up eventually on most successful on-line forums. In fairness, since you are new, the type of member name calling you engage in is grounds to get you banned. If that is what you want, just keep posting away and don't forget to add more colorful language to your insults.
Click to expand...

Maybe the other rag boaters kicked Canuck off the island, now he's washed up on the shores of CSR and we're stuck with him.:eek:
 
ttmott said:
Actually Canuck01, I’m happy you are here; I have a couple of situational questions that I could use some candid response. Actually, three situations this last Saturday but it’s definitely a trend.

First – we were moving south on the Intercoastal waterway here in East Central Florida at trawler speed (16 knots) and were hugging the right side of the waterway...
Click to expand...

I'd like to see this discourse move in this direction. I'm a powerboater, but I grew up with sailboats and plan to go back to them at some point. I haven't participated in this thread because I didn't see any value in it, but maybe that could change.

I think we've all been in situations similar to Mott's. It's worth discussing IMO. (but Mott, where did the notion of 16 knots in a 52DB being "trawler speed" come from??)
 
Canuck01 has decided that the Captain of the powerboat is completely at fault. While it certainly looks that way, I would suggest that we wait for the conclusion of the investigation. There are other possibilities, however remote. One being a subtle incapacitation of the skipper. In the airline biz we train for this. The skipper could have been at the helm looking forward but unable to perform. Not likely, but....
 
Getting another bag of chips...anyone have peanuts...someone grab me a Molson, eh?
 
ttmott said:
Actually Canuck01, I’m happy you are here; I have a couple of situational questions that I could use some candid response. Actually, three situations this last Saturday but it’s definitely a trend.

First – we were moving south on the Intercoastal waterway here in East Central Florida at trawler speed (16 knots) and were hugging the right side of the waterway. The channel in this particular area is about 200-300 feet wide and shoaling is prominent outside of the channel; stay in the channel is the message. Northward bound is a 30 something Beneteau with a jib up that was slack; she was under power and moving about 6 knots which I noticed during passing. This sailing (motor) vessel was hugging their left side of the channel and head on to my vessel. With nowhere to maneuver away from what appeared a vessel under sail I pulled my 52 Sedan Bridge to a stop and held steady along my right side of the channel. The Beneteau pulled to the channel center and passed on my port side with a good looking lady (and she was easy on the eyes) yelling various colorful metaphors and giving us the universal finger acknowledgement. They passed then pulled back to their left side of the channel and motored on. I looked back in astonishment with the small children on my vessel asking what that was all about; I had no rational explanation.

Second – This couldn’t be twenty minutes later from the first incident above; Still navigating southward we were moving at about 25 knots and came up on another sailing vessel moving in our direction that was left of channel center. This boat had their mainsail and jib up but both were slack and they also were motoring. That vessel’s (which was an awesome looking Shannon) captain didn’t see us nor had any idea we were behind. We pulled back to trawler speed and sounded one short blast on the horn, and it’s a loud horn, and began to overtake on our port side; the widest part of the channel based upon their position. There was not a horn response from them. The captain of that vessel then maneuvered into us as we were passing and crowed us to the marker side of the channel. When he saw what was overtaking he steered back to the center of the channel then came the message on Ch 16 with a verbal scolding of my lack of navigational knowledge; I responded “let’s go to six eight and talk about it” – crickets……

Third – narrow drawbridge, on what we call the Barge Canal. We were moving under the drawbridge at maneuvering speed which is about 8 knots in the 52. Awaiting on the other side of the bridge was a 35 foot ketch dead nuts in the middle of the bridge waterway exit bow towards us. Sails down they were waiting for the bridge to open. We pulled through but the ketch would not move and we passed on our port side which was the only plausible pathway through and within 4 or 5 feet of their rail. The captain and mate were astonished and appeared quite peeved. My wave did not receive a response.

So, this was last Saturday however it is routine navigational chess for us here in this area. You appear a knowledgeable sailor; how would you respond / critique the above? The message here is, there is ignorance, thoughtlessness, foolishness, and bad attitude that can exist on any vessel but the sailors really showed their wares and lack of, call it knowledge and courtesy, for a much larger vessel the other day…

And, BTW, welcome to our forum; hang around, you will definitely find good entertainment and quite possibly some enlightenment and technical wherewithal.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the welcome! Your anecdotes are interesting - first, I gotta say, we have as many people unaware of the Colregs as you do probably, but at 5 knots, it isn't quite so obvious.
You're talking about the Indian River, an area I know quite well. First situation - the skipper may have thought his deepest area was where he was and decided to hold to it. His chartplotter may have actually shown him on the right side of the channel - a lot of people don't look much outside their cockpit :) to see what's really there. And while we all typically pass port to port, that's not a hard and fast rule. I often pass starboard to when it makes sense or the situation demands it, but I make it obvious well ahead by turning the vessel so that the other captain can see what I'm doing. While what you did was acceptable, you'd have ultimately been better served by moving to the left side of the channel when (I'm presuming this) it became obvious they weren't changing course.
And of course, this could have been one of those dummies who figures any sailboat with linen up has the right of way. Sorry to say but they do exist.

The second one was definitely in the wrong with moving to the center on you - but again, a lot of new boaters don't get horn signals - better always to use the VHF for passing. Most sailors have it on, and they should - but as we know, not always.

The ketch should have made room for you - it's only courteous, and if he didn't, you had to do what you did. If the ketch was annoyed, he should be looking in the mirror for the reason he was bothered.

I think I'm going to enjoy spending some time here - it will do me good to hear the other side of the story, I've been too much in a bubble and that's never good.
 
sound
PlayDate said:
Classic Troll behavior: Argue, insult, bait and name calling.....repeat. I don't know what pleasure people get from it but they apparently do since it shows up eventually on most successful on-line forums. In fairness, since you are new, the type of member name calling you engage in is grounds to get you banned. If that is what you want, just keep posting away and don't forget to add more colorful language to your insults.
Click to expand...
sounds like you have some experience trolling... :)
 
Captn TJ said:
Wow you need to either brush up on your communication skills or take some tranquilizers. If anything your approach turned people off from leaning about sailing and sailors. As an ex sailor of 30 years (sailed all of the great lakes and the Caribbean as well) and most recently a Sea Ray owner, there are pluses and minus to each. There are strong personalities in each group. I also know a few people who've bought large sailboats with not a clue on how to operate them or the rules of the road. Same holds true of some people buying powerboats.

Regardless of the type of boat you operate and the situation you're in, Colregs clearly states that it is the Captain's responsibility to prevent a collision - in that same paragraph of Colregs it doesn't clarify the type of vessel the Captain is operating. Let's leave it at that.

And by the way apparently you haven't been to Cleveland lately so you might want to visit it before you slam it. .
Click to expand...

Actually, I've been to Cleveland relatively recently - I was just returning fire with that remark - nice city, really nice waterfront, but your cabdrivers ought to be shot and pissed on. Yes, there's a story there...

Like you, I know the odd person who buys a large sailboat and has no clue. But in reality, a LOT of people buy large powerboats and have NEVER boated previously, thinking it's like driving a car. Sailors typically start small and move up, and learn the rules as they go. Perhaps you aren't aware of it, but a lot of sailboat dealers offer lessons to any first time buyer. I do not know of a single powerboat dealer who does this - although I'm happy to be corrected on that if such a creature does exist.
 
Last edited:
Handsome Transom said:
The issue at hand is your arrogance . I will not extend the courtesy of welcoming you to the forum because you are beyond rude.. As far as your reference to others attacking the poster instead of the issue being ad hominem I suppose you might be qualified to define that type of of argument since it is a tendency of your writings. BTW what fing rag to you write for ? Just remember opinions are like assholes we all have one ,you just happen to wear yours like a nametag
Click to expand...

How odd - I used to boat out of Dutchman's Cove - are you one of the jagoffs who roars through Asylum Point with a huge wake when there are others there? Or are you Von Diesel, the ultra uber idiot? I heard he got tossed out of his Midland marina for his behaviour. Sorry you're offended, but I think I've seen you on the water before from the sound of you.
 
PlayDate said:
Classic Troll behavior: Argue, insult, bait and name calling.....repeat. I don't know what pleasure people get from it but they apparently do since it shows up eventually on most successful on-line forums. In fairness, since you are new, the type of member name calling you engage in is grounds to get you banned. If that is what you want, just keep posting away and don't forget to add more colorful language to your insults.
Click to expand...



Wait a minute... someone posts something that people disagree with and they are automatically branded a troll? That's as weak of an arguement as obvious trolling is.
 
Black Valkyrie said:
Wait a minute... someone posts something that people disagree with and they are automatically branded a troll? That's as weak of an arguement as obvious trolling is.
Click to expand...


There is a distinctive pattern to Troll behavior. It has zero to deal with their opinion on a given topic. The pattern is: create an argument, bait members with insulting comments, add fuel to fire by using profanity and name calling.

The win for them isn’t sharing knowledge it is getting an established member angry enough to mimic their behavior.

I see it over and over again that there must be a book that guides them.....even their offer to “have a beer” is repeated.

Unfortunately, they stay until they are completely ignored or they get angry enough to be banned.

BTW I believe there is no disagreement over whether the sailboat had the right of way. 99% of the time if they have their sails up most believe they have right of way. The 1% involves stationary objects .....like moored aircraft carriers.
 
Last edited:
Black Valkyrie said:
Wait a minute... someone posts something that people disagree with and they are automatically branded a troll? That's as weak of an arguement as obvious trolling is.
Click to expand...

No, you're missing a key point. Canuck didn't just post something that people disagreed with. What he did was to consciously decide to JOIN CSR and them immediately (in his first TWO posts) begin baiting people into arguing. What else would you call this behavior?

I actually don't disagree with some of the things he said (we power boaters can be just as much a$$holes as sail boaters, even if we don't dress as well). And upon reading the rest of the thread, Canuck seems like a decent guy (except that he drives a Goldwing). But in this case, in this thread, he was trolling. It's not his disagreeing that makes him a troll in this case. It's the premeditated decision to join the group specifically for the purposes of stirring up an argument, and then stirring up the argument. This is about as text book of an example of trolling as you could imagine.
 
scooper321 said:
No, you're missing a key point. Canuck didn't just post something that people disagreed with. What he did was to consciously decide to JOIN CSR and them immediately (in his first TWO posts) begin baiting people into arguing. What else would you call this behavior?

I actually don't disagree with some of the things he said (we power boaters can be just as much a$$holes as sail boaters, even if we don't dress as well). And upon reading the rest of the thread, Canuck seems like a decent guy (except that he drives a Goldwing). But in this case, in this thread, he was trolling. It's not his disagreeing that makes him a troll in this case. It's the premeditated decision to join the group specifically for the purposes of stirring up an argument, and then stirring up the argument. This is about as text book of an example of trolling as you could imagine.
Click to expand...
And you are the self appointed CSR troll police...right ?
 
Canuck01 said:
How odd - I used to boat out of Dutchman's Cove - are you one of the jagoffs who roars through Asylum Point with a huge wake when there are others there? Or are you Von Diesel, the ultra uber idiot? I heard he got tossed out of his Midland marina for his behaviour. Sorry you're offended, but I think I've seen you on the water before from the sound of you.
Click to expand...
If youve seen me boating in Georgian Bay you'll know me a a courteous to a fault boater who slows to 0 wake when near paddle boarders and canoes . I look out for other vessels and adjust my course and or speed to ensure we do not meet..
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Forum statistics

Threads
113,118
Messages
1,426,465
Members
61,034
Latest member
Lukerney
Back
Top