Please delete

That boat you were in has to weigh at lease 10 or 12 thousand pounds and doesn’t seem to be altering the attitude of the sailboat very much.

I find most sail boaters take their right of way thing to an extreme that can be a bit unsafe in that they interpret it as something that means that they can do whatever they like and we’re supposed to get out of the way while they do it.

Glad you’re safe and I think you’ll settle down in time.

I boat in sail infested waters and no matter how hard I try to avoid them often still have a hard time staying clear.
 
As a safe boater i assume everyone does everything they want and sometimes things they don't want and I stay out of their way while they do it. Icould not live with myself if I injured someone because u just figured the stars would align and we could get away with it a close call and some fist waving . 30 knots vs 8 tops who is in the wrong the captain of the mv . I might spend more time with my hull deep in the water but oh well
 
...Stuff happens fast....

Thank you for sharing your story so we can learn. I am greatful for your decision and courage.

In my industry, after a fatality occurred the coworkers of the deceased, at first, were tight lipped. There was fear of liability in many directions. A bit later, the employees and company did a 180 and shared everting they could in hopes of preventing other companies from making the same series of mistakes that lead to the fatality.

Often, accidents occur after multiple mistakes are made. What’s equally disturbing to me is just as often, people not in charge had indications of the danger but choose not to speak up due to rank / position / qualifications of the one in charge making the mistakes. This concept was studied and lead to training changes for comercial airline pilots after the Tenerife airport disaster, the deadliest accident in aviation history.

I’m no expert here, far from it. Only based on what I have read:

1) Captain may have had a issue pre-accident. Perhaps he was fatigued from a long day.

2) VHF was off. Why was that? No one noticed that? I’ve pointed out safety concerns to a skipper for things less significant then that.

3) Crew Resource managment. Sounds like there was a 2nd spotter, which is very good. What was the spotters level of experience and did the spotter have a clear understanding of their responsibility? The spotter could have been the source of a distraction. Just giving a made up example, a inexperienced spotter who is also a client of the charter boat could have been showing the skipper a YouTube fishing video. Not wanting to offend the client, the skipper could have taken his attention off the task of navigation and on the clients smartphone. Not saying thats what did happen, only what could have happened.

What else can we learn from this?

Very glad to read no one was seriously injured.
 
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That boat you were in has to weigh at lease 10 or 12 thousand pounds and doesn’t seem to be altering the attitude of the sailboat very much.

I find most sail boaters take their right of way thing to an extreme that can be a bit unsafe in that they interpret it as something that means that they can do whatever they like and we’re supposed to get out of the way while they do it.

Glad you’re safe and I think you’ll settle down in time.

I boat in sail infested waters and no matter how hard I try to avoid them often still have a hard time staying clear.

Wow, I’ve never seen such ignorance emmanate from one site like this.

Let’s start with what should be obvious: All sailors know there is no “right of way.” Sailors tend to know the colregs and rrs, are consciously reliant on physics, are adept at weather forcasting, and find their way across oceans using the sun and stars. Powerboaters tend to think boating is like driving a car. Period. So put down your driving manual, pick up the colregs, and use relevant terminology.

The power boat was running at 25-30 knots. The sailboat was in light wind with full sails up. Contrary to absurd speculation in this thread, there is no evidence from any photos or comments by involved parties that the sailboat’s engine (that’s singular, not plural, knuckleheads) was running. The sailboat was likely doing no more than 4-5 kts. The sailboat had only two people—not a race crew. If you’ve never sailed, this means tacking or jybing does not happen instantaneously—like turning a powerboat’s wheel. Clearly, only one boat had the maneuverability to avoid an accident in close quarters with that closing speed.

The sailboat tried to hail the motorboat. As we know from the OP, the powerboat’s radio was off until the OP turned it on. The sailboat did try to avoid the accident, but it was futile with the powerboat bearing down on it.

There is a reason why sailboats are the stand-on vessel in these situations. The charter captain should lose his license. The rest of you would do well to learn your colregs and apply some thought and insight to boating. Safe and competent boating requires more than a key and a case of beer. Most of the commenters here clearly do not understand.
 
Concur, guilty as charged. Should a good ole fashion "keel hauling" suffice as punishment ?
 
Jbaffoh,

Just to kind of give you the lay of the land here on clubsearay.com, this is a site dedicated to Sea Ray boats and their owners, plus a few off brand owners who have registered. There are roughly 45,000 members who own everything from an 18 ft bow rider up to 65' fly bridge models. The vast majority of members are lake or river boaters who are not required to operate by the navigation rules and likely don't even know what "colregs" refers to. However, there are very likely a couple of thousand of us who are experienced seamen and are licensed captains operating in coastal areas, and many of them hold 100 ton Masters Licenses with many years experience an a lot of blue water under the hulls. Most of them, like me, don't know enough about the circumstances or area to even comment.

Statements like "........The rest of you would do well to learn your colregs and apply some thought and insight to boating. Safe and competent boating requires more than a key and a case of beer. " won't win many friends here and makes a poor first impression for a first post.
 
Jbaffoh,

Just to kind of give you the lay of the land here on clubsearay.com, this is a site dedicated to Sea Ray boats and their owners, plus a few off brand owners who have registered. There are roughly 45,000 members who own everything from an 18 ft bow rider up to 65' fly bridge models. The vast majority of members are lake or river boaters who are not required to operate by the navigation rules and likely don't even know what "colregs" refers to. However, there are very likely a couple of thousand of us who are experienced seamen and are licensed captains operating in coastal areas, and many of them hold 100 ton Masters Licenses with many years experience an a lot of blue water under the hulls. Most of them, like me, don't know enough about the circumstances or area to even comment.

Statements like "........The rest of you would do well to learn your colregs and apply some thought and insight to boating. Safe and competent boating requires more than a key and a case of beer. " won't win many friends here and makes a poor first impression for a first post.

I was refering to the commenters in this thread. Obviously, you were not one of them.

As for first impressions? I don’t find it particularly desireable to fit in with most of the commenters in this thread. If the majority of members don’t know the regs, why are they rushing to judgment about the sailboat?
 
I was refering to the commenters in this thread. Obviously, you were not one of them.

As for first impressions? I don’t find it particularly desireable to fit in with most of the commenters in this thread. If the majority of members don’t know the regs, why are they rushing to judgment about the sailboat?
Lighten up Francis.
 
Wow!
I am constantly keeping a lookout and will make small course changes miles away to avoid passing close to another vessel. It seems tho sometimes the other guy is magnetically drawn to me tho. NO reason to pass near when you have a whole lake!
Strange...but accidents are just that followed by all the what if’s.
Glad everyone is ok
 
Northern -- does not look like the engine is on. There is no water coming out of the exhaust.
Soulshine -- "Sail infested waters"? When you are driving, do the "pedestrian infested crosswalks" bother you?

That being said, thinking that a 35-foot sailboat can suddenly dodge another vessel closing at 30 knots is a fantasy. Speeding up to get out of the way really isn't an option. Stopping suddenly would be about as effective. While a power boat can change speed relatively easily, this is not the case for a sailboat. So the only options remaining is to veer off. And unless you are having fun in a fully-crewed racing boat or maybe a Hobie 16, that is not a quick action either.

And "The vast majority of members are lake or river boaters who are not required to operate by the navigation rules..."??? Really? Where does is state that boaters are not required to operate by the navigation rules"? I would love to see that code. The rules are not just for salt water; they are universal. The fact that some people chose to ignore them doesn't mean they don't exist. It just means they really shouldn't own a boat.

Bottom line: Clear day, good visibility, calm seas, white boat with two white 50-foot sails up gets t-boned by a motorboat going 30 knots. Unless the sailboat was motoring, which there's no indication of that yet, it appears the motorboat was seriously in the wrong.
 
I am thankful everyone escaped serious injury and death . I'd like to blow up some pics off this accident poster size to put up at the main dock of every marina around here. As a PSA Asking people to be safer boaters.
 
Please delete this thread.


Winch...sorry this got outta hand (if that's the reason you deleted). Glad I got a chance to read it before you deleted it. It was really insightful and helped me with perspective on how quickly things can go wrong, and what to do when they do. Gonna move my life vests to a more accessible spot and making sure to rehearse my safety briefings for when people come aboard. Thank you again for taking the time to eloquently capture your time during this incident. I'm sure it was nerve racking being there, and recounting it couldn't have been easy. It was a great read.
 
I know Winch. I suspect that the reason he took it down is more along the lines of not kicking a man when he's down.
 
Dang, wish I had gotten a chance to read the opening post. I was on my boat in my marina very close to there when it happened. Glad there were no serious injuries. The incident certainly dominated the conversation on the Bay this weekend.

I've been boating on the Bay since shortly after I moved here in 1999. Up until late last summer I've owned sailboats (Catalina 25 and a Hunter 30.) I've seen dangerous/annoying/irresponsible boating by powerboats and sailboats alike unfortunately.
 
As far as sailboat engine on.. the engine can be on. If it is not in gear, it is not "power driven". Sailboats frequently will have the engine on and out of gear to charge batteries, common after hoisting sails to leave the engine on and out of gear for a bit until things are settled and batteries are charged to satisfaction. Also, if there is an impending collision, a sailboater will often throw on the engine as quick as possible to try to avoid the collision if "Rodney" is bearing down. That does not mean by the rules that the sailboat instantly becomes a power driven vessel and is at fault. So it may be that the sailboat engine was on at the time of collision. That does not imply fault on the part of the sailboat.

As far as changing course of the sailboat into the powerboat causing the collision- not likely. At the winds speeds in the photo, the sailboat might have been going 5 knots. Changing course from a non-collision situation to a non-avoidable collision would have taken time, and an alert driver on the powerboat would have seen it. The sailboat could not have spun around fast enough to create an non-avoidable situation in those wind conditions, or even if it was under power. I have sailed in the past on J105 competitively (the sailboat) for the better part of a decade. I know them well.

I'm also a SUNY Maritime deck grad, unlimited tonnage deck license. It will be hard as hell for that powerboat to not be at fault- but not impossible. There could be some circumstance which caused him to not be at fault. So hold final judgement. But glad no injuries- speed is usually the culprit in many boating accidents as with cars.
Also, this area out of Annapolis are my home waters. As far as powerboats complaining about sailboats taking their right of way to extreme, very rare in my experience, but it does happen. Typically it's when sailboats infringe on the small commercial crab boats that I cringe. Ya you might have right of way, but the crabber is trying to eek out a living. Stay out of his way. But more often than not, some jackass is wizzing along at 30 knots in and out of the slow-moving sailboats coming within a few boatlengths, holding a beer. That's why sailors get pissed. It ain't funny, it's dangerous. And every season, somebody dies- without fail.

Not knowing the rules of the road...??? really? COME ON! that is an excuse of some kind? Rules of the road govern all navigable waterways. Educate yourself and avoid these situations.
 
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If the sailboat was under power, he probably noticed the impending collision and fired it up in an attempt to get the heck out of the way.

Sailing is fun, so I have no ill feelings about sailboaters. They can be a "pain" sometimes because they do inconvenience me on occasion. I sometimes feel bad when I go by one on plane, even at a distance, knowing that they aren't going to enjoy my wake when it gets there. So I guess we inconvenience them on occasion as well.
 
So put down your driving manual, pick up the colregs, and use relevant terminology.... If you’ve never sailed, this means tacking or jybing does not happen instantaneously—like turning a powerboat’s wheel.

It’s “jibing” knucklehead.... or if you’re from 1700’s England, maybe gybing.

As for first impressions? I don’t find it particularly desireable to fit in with most of the commenters in this thread.

Then maybe you should rise above all this “ignorance” and not participate?
 

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