When did a boat having a transom become unnecessary?

T

tobnpr

New Member
Nov 12, 2006
3,246
New Port Richey, Florida
Boat Info
1988 300 DA
Engines
tw 350's w/ Alphas
Paging through the new SeaRay Living I noticed the 340 DA (page 11) does not have a transom. Wow... since the beginning of time boats have had transoms. I've always assumed they were necessary, like for keeping the ocean out of your boat...
I'm not talking aesthetics here- I'm referring to fundamental safety issues.
I can visusalize this boat in heavy seas losing power, turning broadside, and the ocean filling the cockpit in half a second.
Who decided that boats don't need a transom anymore?
 
I think what is shown on that page is the new 350 DA...
 
There's a transom there. Not very big but it's there + that small of a transom limits the amount of Pirates that can board
 
What do you mean "no transom"? It appears to have a transom to me. Are you referring to the double walk throughs? If so, keep the pointy end toward the waves and you'll be much better off. Have you ever seen a sportfish back down on a fish? Imagine a 60' footer going 12 knots in reverse with the whole cockpit underwater. The cockpit will shed the water quickly. Keep the salon door closed.
 
Doral has a couple of models like that. I think it's Doral

Best regards,
Frank
 
The good part is (if your salon door is closed) that water coming over the bow will go straight out the back. If I take water over the bow in my 280 SS. . .that water is going to be in the cockpit for a while.
 
Pirate said:
What do you mean "no transom"? It appears to have a transom to me. Are you referring to the double walk throughs? If so, keep the pointy end toward the waves and you'll be much better off. Have you ever seen a sportfish back down on a fish? Imagine a 60' footer going 12 knots in reverse with the whole cockpit underwater. The cockpit will shed the water quickly. Keep the salon door closed.
Click to expand...

Comparing the DA to a 60' battlewagon is like comparing a Corvette to a Buick.
I'm not talking about backing down- that would obviously sink the DA. And that's not a transom- it's nothing but a built-in module with a couple of swing doors.
The SF is going to have a transom door that does a relatively good job of keeping the ocean out of the boat when backing down- the water filling the cockpit is from waves splashing over the transom.

If you paid attention to my original post- I referenced a specific circumstance of the boat losing power in heavy seas and turning broadside, and what effect the lack of a transom (and sorry- there is NO transom) would have on the boat's seakeeping ability.
How are you going to keep the "pointy end" into the seas with no power?
 
That is a fairly good point. But I am now going to exhibit some lack of nautical knowledge: I must admit that without power, I am not seeing how the bow of DA is going to stay in the wind.

????? I lack clue. Please educate me ?????

All I know. .. is that if I have a following sea. . .those transom doors would make me a bit nervous. (note that if my cockpit got swamped, I would also be worried) But again. . .I lack knowledge in this area.

But one thing I *really* know is that those doors look really good on the sales dock. . and selling the boat off the sales dock is REALLY important. Also, most boats like that don't venture out from the dock very often. The parties thrown dockside are probably more important to the majority of owners than seaworthiness in a 10' following sea.
 
tobnpr said:
Comparing the DA to a 60' battlewagon is like comparing a Corvette to a Buick.
I'm not talking about backing down- that would obviously sink the DA. And that's not a transom- it's nothing but a built-in module with a couple of swing doors.
The SF is going to have a transom door that does a relatively good job of keeping the ocean out of the boat when backing down- the water filling the cockpit is from waves splashing over the transom.

If you paid attention to my original post- I referenced a specific circumstance of the boat losing power in heavy seas and turning broadside, and what effect the lack of a transom (and sorry- there is NO transom) would have on the boat's seakeeping ability.
How are you going to keep the "pointy end" into the seas with no power?
Click to expand...

Easy chief. I'm not trying to flame anyone here. You're right, there is a big difference between a sportfish and Sea Ray. Transom doors, however, get far more in the way of water exiting the cockpit than they do to prevent its entry. On the battlewagons, it's NOT spray and waves that pop over the back. The entire cockpit often becomes submerged. The large scuppers and *removed* transom door aid in the speedy exodus of the water. Though not designed or intended for that use, a Sea Ray will dump a cockpit full of water. I took a breaking wave over the top of my former 340DA. If the transom door had been removed and, better yet, there had been a second one, it would have been MUCH better. I can't imagine the situation would have been any different no matter which direction the wave had come from or whether or not I was under power. If the cockpit fills, you want the water out. The transom doors do very little (if anything) to keep water out. They're either 1/2" starboard secured with a single pin or they're molded fiberglass (again secured with a small pin) and a large hole at the bottom.

As far as keeping the pointy end into the waves with no power. If you're without power in conditions like that, you better get a sea anchor, an anchor (even if it's too deep), or some other form of drogue out to keep the bow into or at a 30 deg angle to the waves. It's IMPERATIVE to keep the pointy end that direction.
 
OK... I'll answer your question.

tobnpr said:
If you paid attention to my original post- I referenced a specific circumstance of the boat losing power in heavy seas and turning broadside, and what effect the lack of a transom (and sorry- there is NO transom) would have on the boat's seakeeping ability.
Click to expand...

None.

Now you should go pull your Chapmans out and look up the definition of "transom". The boat does have a transom. It ends at the cockpit deck. That boat is built just like my 480 DB with the trunk area being a bolt on item on top of the cockpit deck. However, I only have a single door. I believe every modern Sea Ray is built this way.

You seem to be assuming that if water goes into the cockpit it will go into the engine room and fill the hull and sink the boat. The rear of my boat, and all the other Sea Rays, is sealed and is water tight and you could dunk the whole back end in water and it is not going to get in the engine room. I've taken a big wave over the back of my boat... don't recall thinking the boat was going to sink (I did almost wash my kid off the boat though). The water ran off the back end in seconds.

Go look at outboard sport fish boats... same design...

So with your solid transom that is several feet above the cockpit deck, if you took a wave over the back, where does the water go?
 
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I know on my Parker the cockpit will fill with water FAST when backing down on fish. There have been times when the scuppers could not keep up with the few inches of water on the deck - enough to actually float the cooler around a bit. I assume the 270 will do ok - it has 2 drains in the recess of the engine hatches and the gap under the transom door. As far as transoms go - am I correct in thinking all boats have them? At least I/O or OB - the OB motor and I/O drives have to mount somewhere.
 
Four Suns said:
So with your solid transom that is several feet above the cockpit deck, if you took a wave over the back, where does the water go?
Click to expand...

I'd open the transom door :).

My question was sparked by a real-life experience, taking a BUNCH of water over the cut-out transom of an outboard powered boat.
It was a domino effect- as the initial surge of water entered the boat, the additional weight made the boat heavier and the situation got scary- quick. Moving bodies and equipment forward had no effect- water is some HEAVY sh**. Turned on the key and shoved the throttle forward, drove up on the anchor line (the least of my concern) and watched a tsunami exit over the splashwell. Fortunately all ended well...

What it made me realize is that under those circumstances the normal attitude of the boat resting in the water changed. A boat in seas does not rest with it's bow always higher than the stern, or rather with the deck always pitched aft to shed water as it was designed to do. As the stern rises on a swell, it becomes higher than the bow- and water would tend to pool forward towards the cabin door. As the bow rises then, you say, the water would just flow out the back of the boat. Like I said, I was wondering whether a few tons of water in the cockpit would change the attitude of the boat to where this might not happen.
I'm no engineer; but I do know that if the situtation I described intially WERE to happen, that hull would take water over the stern. I was simply wondering if it would shed it as fast as it came in.
 
At 8.3lbs/gallon it would certainly be a lot of weight. But following the example of a 'scary situation' I'd rather have a fast draining transom door instead of dealing with trying to open one with all that water behind it. Who's going to be doing that? The captain trying to maintain heading? Or more likely a guest that won't realize the out rushing water is going to suck them right overboard. Now you've got even more trouble on your hands.

I've had to deal with taking waves over the bow (50kt gusts and 7' seas, what fun) While a LOT of water hit the cockpit, the combination of the transom opening and the tilt of the boat into the waves cleared it out pretty quickly.
 
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