Official Cummins 6cta 450C thread

Great thread! I have the 480CE which is really the same engine with the first attempt at computer control. I have gone through the overprop issue from Sea Ray. my factory props were 23x27 4 blade hytorq. After a dropped valve seat in the stbd. engine I was advised via boat diesel to take out two inches of pitch. I did that but found I was then under propped. Ultimately I switched to new Acme's. During this process I found out that Sea Ray used a large amount of cupping. .130 I was told that each .030 of cup would result in 45 rpm. So if anyone is looking at a re-pitch have your prop guy check the cupping as well.

Mike,

What was your WOT RPMs with 27" pitch and what was the result of the adjusting it to 25"? I'm running HyTorque 23x26 with #.11 cup. My WOT range 2680-2700.

Also, what's your experience with Acme's?
 
Mike,

What was your WOT RPMs with 27" pitch and what was the result of the adjusting it to 25"? I'm running HyTorque 23x26 with #.11 cup. My WOT range 2680-2700.

Also, what's your experience with Acme's?

Alex,


With the 23x27 and a light load I would hit the governor speed of 2680 on the stbd. And could get to 2650 on the port. The fuel flows at various rpm's were well above the Cummins curve. Tony at Sbmar suggested removing 2 inches of pitch. He also recommended following the fuel curve of the 450C. After removing the two inches both engines easily hit the governor speed with a fully loaded boat. I was, however, below the curve for the 450C. Rather than continue with the Hytorq's I talked to my prop guy and Acme. They suggested 24x26 for my boat. They came with .045 cup. They also have an increased blade area. Now with a loaded boat I just hit the governor with both engines. I am very close to the 450C fuel flow numbers and picked up 2 knots of cruise at 2200rpm. The folks at Acme told me that .030 of cup equals 45 rpm.


Hope this helps
 
Alex,


With the 23x27 and a light load I would hit the governor speed of 2680 on the stbd. And could get to 2650 on the port. The fuel flows at various rpm's were well above the Cummins curve. Tony at Sbmar suggested removing 2 inches of pitch. He also recommended following the fuel curve of the 450C. After removing the two inches both engines easily hit the governor speed with a fully loaded boat. I was, however, below the curve for the 450C. Rather than continue with the Hytorq's I talked to my prop guy and Acme. They suggested 24x26 for my boat. They came with .045 cup. They also have an increased blade area. Now with a loaded boat I just hit the governor with both engines. I am very close to the 450C fuel flow numbers and picked up 2 knots of cruise at 2200rpm. The folks at Acme told me that .030 of cup equals 45 rpm.


Hope this helps

Thanks for details, Mike.

2 kts gain is very good.
 
I am preparing to do annual service to our main Cummins CTA 8.1 M3 engines and Onan 9K genset in June (with a marine mechanic friend!) and have been poring though the various manuals trying to compile a list of all the part numbers and quantities I need - fuel filters, oil filters, oil, pencil zincs, belts, etc. It's like looking for needle in haystack (actually in multiple manuals and brochures). Is there an easier way to do this? Seem like there should be a comprehensive list already developed for these engines that I could just print out and go buy everything. I found one reference in the Cummins manual to a "Cruise Kit" that looks like it contains the parts for an annual service. Any guidance or links to websites would be appreciated.
 
I made up a maintenance schedule with part numbers and sources. I'll be glad to send it to you if you pm me your email. Sorry but it includes a Westerbeke generator rather than an Onan.
 
I am preparing to do annual service to our Onan 9K genset in June I need - fuel filters, oil filters, oil, pencil zincs, belts, etc..

Fuel Filter: A026K278 (on engine) Racor 2010 PM-0R (turbine filter)
Oil Filter: 185-5835
Oil: same as you run in the mains (15-40 diesel) I use rotella T or Valvoline Premium Blue, it doesn't matter.
pencil zinc: Scicast international AE-1G 1/2" x 1" x 3/8-16 (aluminum) or Boatzincs E-1GZ (zinc)
Belt-V: 185-6934 (37.5")
Impeller: Sherwood 10077K (take the pump off the engine to replace the impeller, a lot easier, just use RTV gasket maker instead of paper gasket on re-install)
 
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Thanks Mark! Much appreciated. What is an RTV gasket maker?
 
I just re-sent. I think I did it wrong the first time.
 
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Got it - thanks. BTW I assume you are referring to removal of the pump to change the impeller in the pump on the ONAN only, not the main engines?
 
Yes, the onan. I don't know how difficult your access will be on the starboard main, but you might be better off removing that pump too for impeller install. you will have to decide that.
 
What is the general concensus to eliminating the zincs in the top of the aftercooler? I have heard of removing the tops due to the minimal wear, and my experience is needing replacement every 2ND year...
 
What is the general concensus to eliminating the zincs in the top of the aftercooler? I have heard of removing the tops due to the minimal wear, and my experience is needing replacement every 2ND year...
Oh man. If we eliminate them then I won't have a on hand spare for the bottom zinc. That's kinda how I use them. I also see very minimal wear on the heat exchanger zinc. All the water drains out of it after the engine is shut down. Now that bottom zinc on the aftercooler - now he is a workhorse. Although I have now started freshwater flushing when I won't be going out for a while. Will see if that lengthens their life.. Anecdotally, did you see the thread here about the 10 year old freshwater boat with the original zincs with concerns they weren't worn enough? Silly freshwater boaters.
 
I did read that thread, and probably the reason I thought about this ha. Interesting on the fresh wash. How are you setting it up?
 
I did read that thread, and probably the reason I thought about this ha. Interesting on the fresh wash. How are you setting it up?
Poor man's approach. Simply bought a 3" PVC screw on end cap from the plumbing department and screwed a hose fitting into the square "box" on the end of it. When I flush I unscrew strainer top and screw this on in its place. Screw on the hose and turn the water on with the seacock OPEN (it stays open for the flushing). Water runs through the strainer back out the seacock into the ocean. Start the engine and run it for a few minutes. Mostly fresh hose water gets pumped in but probably a hint of the salty seawater gets through as well. Probably a 90% solution or so. Turn off engine, turn off hose, then return normal strainer lid to its rightful spot. It takes me a little while this way but I'm retired so I got the time. Too lazy to hook up a permanent solution with metal strainer caps/overthecounter flush adapters and extension hoses into the trunk and all. Got more important things on the never ending list.
 
Has anyone adjusted their fuel aneroid? Since I've owned it, one of my engines has had a slight delay (a few seconds) spooling up the turbo and after eliminating everything else (air restriction, exhaust leak, etc) I'd like to see if adjusting the aneroid will make a difference. Here is a link to pictures of it: http://www.sbmar.com/articles/aneroid-adjustment-on-the-bosch-p7100-injection-pump/

Are you running an engine synchronizer? Depending on its operation a lag on one engine might be normal.

Have the props been scanned? A slight difference in prop or cup can cause these symptoms too.
 
Are you running an engine synchronizer? Depending on its operation a lag on one engine might be normal.

Have the props been scanned? A slight difference in prop or cup can cause these symptoms too.

There is no synchronizer installed on this boat. Props were recently pulled and reworked. I have thought the same as you, that it's just normal tolerances and don't mess with it. But poking around at ideas right now.
 

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