Can the plane take off?

TimW said:

You still are gonna pin your hopes to the mythical chuckleheads driving at the EXACT SPEED at every millisecond to match the question????
Even if I thought it would work, ANY deviation in speed renders results invalid to OP’s hypothesis.

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bajturner said:

Yes

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ttmott said:

It doesn't say that. The condition is "The conveyor belt is designed to match the speed of the wheels, in the opposite direction". Again, who cares what the wheels are doing. The wheels can go fast or slow or forwards or backwards it doesn't matter' they do not inhibit the body and wings from going backwards or forwards. The Only thing the conveyor does is speed up or slow down the wheels.

So in this case the conveyor moves the same direction as the airplane moving down the "runway" which counters the rotation of the wheels. Matching the speed of the wheels the conveyor will be the same speed as the aircraft moving down the runway and will completely stop the wheel rotation.
BUT, the aircraft is moving down the conveyor at the same speed as the conveyor (coincidently as the two have nothing to do with each other) and it takes off.

Hold it - you are messing with me right?

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Blueone said:

Hey …. I unwatchable this thread…. When you guys stop commenting on my posts and stop liking my posts….. I can move on

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bajturner said:

The problem doesn't state the wheels can't advance. It states the treadmill matches the wheel speed in the opposite direction (which was identified as a control feedback impossibility, and assumed to mean the equivalent, opposite speed of the aircraft).

Regardless of the speed of the treadmill, it doesn't stop the plane from moving forward.

As in other examples given, could you pull a wagon off the front of a moving treadmill. Of course you can!

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RBB said:

U r getting drawn right back into this debate sir. Time to have cocktail.

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ttmott said:

Yea, cocktail that's it...... Triple Gin and Tonic; hold the lime, hold the ice, hold the tonic.

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jmauld said:

BTW, the original post, does not contain a hypothesis.

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TimW said:

Ok, not in so many words.

However, in practice it does:



That the conveyor speed precisely matches wheel speed.

Premise, rather than hypothesis, might have been better choice of wording on my part.


The chuckleheads “experiment” is still highly suspect.

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TimW said:

Force is force

If you walk at same speed as treadmill your ground speed is zero

If engine produces sufficient energy to move at speed treadmill moves at, ground speed is zero

Unless outside force is moving the air over the wing at a speed high enough to generate lift, nothing is gonna happen.

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RBB said:

Sir i am a rocket scientist and I think u nailed it. Carry on.

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TimW said:

I am (or at least was in previous career) a scientist, although not of the rocket surgery variety, and I HIGHLY doubt I’m actually correct.

Just seriously disagree with couple points/assumptions that jmauld makes.

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RBB said:

I have never been correct, ask my wife.

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TimW said:

Force is force

If you walk at same speed as treadmill your ground speed is zero

If engine produces sufficient energy to move at speed treadmill moves at, ground speed is zero

Unless outside force is moving the air over the wing at a speed high enough to generate lift, nothing is gonna happen.

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1. a dried smoked herring, which is turned red by the smoke.
2. something, especially a clue, that is or is intended to be misleading or distracting.
   "the book is fast-paced, exciting, and full of red herrings"
   synonyms: bluff, blind, ruse, feint, deception, subterfuge, hoax, trick, ploy, device, wile, sham, pretense, artifice, cover, smokescreen, distraction, expedient, contrivance, machination, dodge, put-on, put-up job

northshore said:

red her·ring
/ˈˌred ˈheriNG/

noun

1. a dried smoked herring, which is turned red by the smoke.
2. something, especially a clue, that is or is intended to be misleading or distracting.
   "the book is fast-paced, exciting, and full of red herrings"
   synonyms: bluff, blind, ruse, feint, deception, subterfuge, hoax, trick, ploy, device, wile, sham, pretense, artifice, cover, smokescreen, distraction, expedient, contrivance, machination, dodge, put-on, put-up job

Conveyor = Flaming Arse Red Hering

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